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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DrSpunj" data-source="post: 1461012" data-attributes="member: 994">Done. You should have it waiting for you. Anyone else?Well, that's just it. I figure someone who heads out into the wilderness, dungeons, alternate planes and evil beings' homes like adventurers do would really develop a sense of Awareness about their surroundings. I think it's Planesailing, IIRC, that actually automatically gives character level bonuses to Listen, Search & Spot, regardless of class types. This (I believe) is meant to reflect that any adventurer, if they survive long enough, gets naturally better at keeping their own skin safe.I didn't want to go that far, essentially demanding that every adventurer get better at those 3 skills, but I did want the opportunity there for those that wanted to put a few points there, and with the reduced cost they don't feel like they're cheating themselves out of some other potential benefit at the 2-to-1 cost.Now, I have to admit, everyone taking some Tumble would be a bit munchkiny, but thankfully that really doesn't happen. For one thing, with 4 SPs/lvl as standard I try and encourage skill use a lot so many players still don't feel that's enough to do everything they want. That's okay, as they're forced to make choices. Some *do* choose to put some ranks in Tumble, but then they're likely to find situations to use it, which I like. After all, I want them to feel good about the choices they've made. Two, Medium Armor in my game doesn't reduce Base Speed, only Run speed (Heavy Armor does reduce Base Speed, but doesn't further reduce your Run speed, it is still x3). I did that so Medium Armor was actually worth wearing, and that's what happens. But those people in Medium Armor can't use Tumble, so they often only take ~5 ranks to get their Fighting Defensively bonus up (and 5 ranks cross-class can't be done until 7th level anyway) and to give them a chance at avoiding AoOs during ambushes at their campsite when they're not wearing their armor.Three, Tumble doesn't fit a lot of character concepts, and I'm lucky enough to play with some people that won't put 5 ranks there just to get the mechanical bonuses. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />I think that's the underlying difference in our viewpoints: I, too, believe that putting SPs into X helps differentiate their characters, but it becomes a relative difference rather than "do you have that skill at all or not". With the cross-class maximums still in place I get a good relative difference: I get Specialists that shine more often than the other characters whenever that skill is needed. But, with the reduced cross-class cost both I as the DM and the players themselves benefit from often having a couple other PCs around with similar skills who can contribute with a good roll (or at least, a bit better than the Specialists if they happen to roll poorly).Umm, sorry for the hijack, Ranger5. <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/nervous.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":heh:" title="Nervous Laugh    :heh:" data-shortname=":heh:" />Thanks.DrSpunj</blockquote>

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