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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mercurius" data-source="post: 5845804" data-attributes="member: 59082">Rather than just add on to <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/new-horizons-upcoming-edition-d-d/319488-re-visiting-tiers.html" target="_blank">another re-visit of tiers</a>, I thought I'd offer a variant take that might kill two rocs with one crossbow bolt; that is, offer--but not require--a variation of game play that many (but not all) enjoy: superheroic D&D.This inquiry started with the question: What if upper level tiers (and "superheroic" play) were modular options? And would it be possible to make them modular options without artificially capping levels so that those wishing to continue a "Classic" adventurer-style campaign could do so beyond the first 5-10 levels? Let's start with the basic idea of tiers as explicated by 4E. You have a heroic tier which represents "classic" D&D: fighting orcs and ogres, dungeoncrawls, regional threats, etc. Then you have paragon tier in which the PCs become true heroes, fighting dragons and drow, becoming "names" in the larger world, even venturing beyond the world into the planes. Finally you have epic tier in which the PCs are not just heroes but legends - bordering into demigodhood.One complaint of 4E--and one that I share--is that even heroic tier starts out too, well, heroic. There is no room for playing the blacksmith's apprentice who picks up his hammer to defend the village from an orc invasion, or an apprentice mage firing her first awkward magic missile, or an adolescent beggar stealing the wrong jewel from the wrong merchant. So the question came to me: can tiers be optional? What if paragon and epic tier were modular options that could be added to (or not) a classic heroic campaign, yet without capping heroic levels?When I first started playing with this idea in this post, I wrote up a system for tiers as modular options. But then I realized something: tiers aren't necessary. Not only are they not necessary, but they add a level of abstraction that potentially obfuscates what we're really looking at, which is optional power increases at higher levels.So this is what I came up with--and forgive me if someone's already played with this idea, but its utter simplicity and flexibility is, imo, a perfect fit for what we believe 5E to be:There are no tiers but there are (something akin to) Paragon Paths and Epic Destinies, which are modular options at higher levels.In other words, the default play style is what could be described as "Adventurer" play, reminiscent of early forms of D&D. A 20th level Classic character would still be powerful, but would look more like Conan or Aragorn than a wuxia martial arts master. In other words, one could advance indefinitely but never become an Exalted-style superhero, unless a game group wants to go that route. This allows the gratification of leveling up for everyone, even folks who don't want epic-style play.At some point, say 11th level, a DM can offer the option to take a Paragon Path, which would include greater powers and a more heroic style of play. Further down the line, say at 21st level, Epic Destinies would become an option; even further, say at 31st level, something like "Immortal Ascensions" would be possible. In this approach there is simply no need for tiers, but nothing is lost either. Theoretically these options could become available whenever the DM and/or game group wants them to be. Let's say a group doesn't want to introduce Paragon Paths at all and prefers a classic "adventurer-style" campaign. But then let's say at about 13th or 14th level they get bored and want to spruce things up; they could then take Paragon Paths and become more akin to truly heroic characters. Epic Destinies would become options further on.So, in summary: Open-ended levels for classic game play, with advancement and/or power increase slowing down at higher levels. No tiers, but Paragon Paths, Epic Destinies, and even Immortal Ascensions as modular options. Maybe I'm missing something, but what's not to like here? It seems that this approach truly accomplishes the best of both worlds: offering open-ended non-epic advancement, but also allowing for superheroic high level play. Or, to put it another way: Two rocs + one crossbow bolt = two dead birds.</blockquote>

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