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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Coredump" data-source="post: 2303513" data-attributes="member: 6939">yay, I love useful civil conversations.... No, but it is the only one that allows you to hit at 10 *and* 5 feet, which is what makes it SO useful in WWA.IMHO, spiked chain is more 'powerful' than WWA, for a number of reasons. I was not clear, I wouldn't necessarily eliminate it; just nerf the combo. (ex. SC can only WWA within 5'. Or, SC can WWA at 5' or 10', but not both.) If you looked at the effectiveness of WWA with a different style, it would not be nearly as powerful. WWA is an 'area of effect' attack. SC increases the area by 150%. Well, um... uh...  my bad, that should have been obvious. Sure, I understand. But now you are fine tuning the encounter even more. Yes If you have a limited front engagement, the bad guys can't move well, and there are lots of buffs, and thus are easy to hit.... that makes WWA/PA a very potent combination.  But now do the math if he needs an 11 instead. Now the -5 from PA cuts his damage output *in half*. So it is only really worth it if they are very easy, or very hard to hit.But lets compare two spiked chain weilders. One takes as you are concerned.PA+Combat Expertise+ Dodge+ Mobility+ Spring Attack+WWA  That is 6 feats. He will be *very* effective when surrounded by mooks that are very easy to hitBut what if he tookPA+cleave+TWF+ITWF+GTWF+combat reflexes.He is not very effective ALL THE TIME. he gets tons of AoO's. Lets assume 11th level. So he goes from 3 to 6 attacks per round PLUS any from cleave PLUS any AoO. I wouldn't doubt it if he could average 7-8 attacks EVERY round. And when he is surrounded by mooks that are easy to hit, he will get even more from cleave..How often do you think he will get 7-8 attacks from WWA?Hey, I am all about less frustration and fun games. But I bet WWA would not be all that impressive if you actually use it. Once in a while, sure. but a really well placed (aka lucky) fireball is also.</blockquote>

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