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<blockquote data-quote="Nonlethal Force" data-source="post: 2686888" data-attributes="member: 35788">This is really a moot argument, though.&nbsp; Because the same is true for all races.&nbsp; If you choose elf you loose the feat and the skillpoints, too.&nbsp; You gain immunity to sleep, bonuses against enchantments, lowlight vision, elven weapons, listen/spot/search check bonues, and a bonus elven language.If you choose halfling, you lose the feat and the skill points for a small AC/attack boost, the pluses to move silently, the pluses to saves, the pluses with thrown weapons, etc...And I could go on and on for every race.The point is ... your argument just takes it from a different frame of reference.&nbsp; What I was saying is that if you want to choose a human, you gain a feat and 4 skillpoints without an LA adjustment.&nbsp; If you want to choose a hobgoblin you gan gain a boost to two stats (with no negatives) darkvision, and the move silently bonus for an LA adjustment of +1.&nbsp; -OR- I allow my players to take a boost to one stat and a negative to the other (which balances each other out) and giving a +4 to move silently and darkvision.&nbsp; So, essentially, you are trading and extra skillpoint per level and a feat for darkvision and the +4 for move silently.And if you actually read my words, you will see that I cleraly admit that it makes the hobgoblin a little underpowered.&nbsp; But most of my players that want the hobgoblin play it for style - not because they care about powergaming anyway.But really it is just a frame of reference.&nbsp; You could use the elf as the base, or the dwarf, or the gnome, or ... well ... you get my point.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Nonlethal Force, post: 2686888, member: 35788"] This is really a moot argument, though. Because the same is true for all races. If you choose elf you loose the feat and the skillpoints, too. You gain immunity to sleep, bonuses against enchantments, lowlight vision, elven weapons, listen/spot/search check bonues, and a bonus elven language. If you choose halfling, you lose the feat and the skill points for a small AC/attack boost, the pluses to move silently, the pluses to saves, the pluses with thrown weapons, etc... And I could go on and on for every race. The point is ... your argument just takes it from a different frame of reference. What I was saying is that if you want to choose a human, you gain a feat and 4 skillpoints without an LA adjustment. If you want to choose a hobgoblin you gan gain a boost to two stats (with no negatives) darkvision, and the move silently bonus for an LA adjustment of +1. -OR- I allow my players to take a boost to one stat and a negative to the other (which balances each other out) and giving a +4 to move silently and darkvision. So, essentially, you are trading and extra skillpoint per level and a feat for darkvision and the +4 for move silently. And if you actually read my words, you will see that I cleraly admit that it makes the hobgoblin a little underpowered. But most of my players that want the hobgoblin play it for style - not because they care about powergaming anyway. But really it is just a frame of reference. You could use the elf as the base, or the dwarf, or the gnome, or ... well ... you get my point. [/QUOTE]

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