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Message: <blockquote data-quote="shurai" data-source="post: 2356907">I don't know if I agree with you here, since Clerics don't get Spot or Listen as class skills.  This means, by definition, that they cannot be as good at noticing things as, say, a Rogue, Ranger, or Monk.Truthfully I think of priests and the clergy as being more wise than charismatic, although being charismatic is certainly an asset to them.  If you examine religious documents (from whatever religion I'd guess, though I'm no expert), they always speak glowingly of the 'wise man' not the 'charismatic man'.So, not to slide into forbidden territory regarding the messageboard policies here (I think I'm being on-topic; mods please correct me if not!), but speaking for myself, as a man of faith, I consider my relationship with my deity to be influenced much more strongly influenced by whatever wisdom I possess rather than, of all things, charisma.  I would guess that most religious people would agree.Still, it's your campaign, so if you like your house rules and your players prefer them, more power to you.Certainly it is also the case that the wisest characters are often the most iron-willed and least susceptible to corruption, temptation, coercion, and deception, in real life as in literature.  Some of the wisest people I know are also the most indominable.  Conversely, the greatest fools I've ever known also had weak wills.  Literary and cinematic examples of this correlation abound.As far as the realism of perception skills being based on wisdom goes, I'd say it makes some sense.  I guess the logic is that a wise man is a perceptive man, most of the time.  In fantasy literature it's usually the "wisest" people that are the most perceptive.  In Eastern philosophy too heightened awareness is associated with great wisdom.  Still, I see the point of people who suggest a Perception ability score; I think it makes enough sense that I'd go along with it, gamewise.I'd say physical appearance belongs in the realm of feats, though, since if it were an ability score it would be an even greater dump stat than Charisma is now.  How about a Good-Looking feat, that gives a +2 to +4 to social skills, depending on when appearance is likely to be a factor?-S</blockquote>

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