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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8373168" data-attributes="member: 6801228">Why can't an elf match a hobgoblin in endurance? Besides, the entire point I was responding to was that these bonuses help define the race. But, if asked who the best archers are, I'm not going to say Kobolds, despite them having the same +2 Dex as Elves. Or goblins. Or halflings... so how is it the +2 Dex that makes Elves the best archers? The entire system seems backwards to me, we declared them the best at something, gave them a +2, and now people are saying that the +2 means they are the best at something, but that's never how it worked. We never went and observed an elf in the wild to determine that they had a +2 and then determined that meant they were excellent archers.So it is easier as a player to argue to break the rules (go from hard code to floating) than it is to argue to follow the rules? (Use floating to match the hard code)Somehow, that doesn't seem to make sense.Seems everyone forgets thatYou broke the quote in the wrong place. And again, you are conflating two things. A goliath with a +2 strength is not lifting twice what a human lifts. A +2 strength is 60 lbs, that takes the goliath scale to (10-37) if you want to be technical. Powerful Build gives you a +0 strength, it is a completely separate ability, but is also would take a goliath who is identical to a human (ie does not have the +2 strength) and make their scale (16 - 72) In other words, that +2 strength does not make Goliaths super strong. Powerful Build does that. The +2 Strength is nearly meaningless and clutching on and saying that the difference between (8-36) and (10-37) is super massive and defining is a head scratcher. It means nothing.Then take away powerful build, the ability that actually lets them lift twice what a human can. Oh wait. Then you wouldn't have an argument. Because your argument is based on something that isn't true. Loxodon get a +2 Con, +1 Wis, they can also lift twice what a human can because they have powerful build. The +2 strength doesn't apply at all. Or if it does, then Loxodon are supposed to also have a +2 strength.No, it wasn't working for me.Do me a favor. In forty years, check and see how many world records have been broken. Because I'm willing to bet that just like the previous 40 years, where we had achieved the top human performance and reached the peak of what was possible, that in 40 years time we'll have people breaking those records and setting a new standard for the peak of what is humanly possible. And, again, my point was never that physiology has changed (though it does make you wonder how we keep finding world records broken every 3 to 5 years) but that it seems silly to say that something is utterly impossible. It was impossible yesterday for a man to lift as much as they can lift today, so why are so confident in saying that what men can lift today is impossible for a woman to lift tomorrow? Improbable? Sure. Impossible? I don't feel comfortable making that assertion.</blockquote>

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