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<blockquote data-quote="Bill Zebub" data-source="post: 8381925" data-attributes="member: 7031982">Then I think it's possible that you genuinely are not understanding part of the optimizer mindset, especially because you use the computer game example.&nbsp; Although I don't play a lot of video games, when I do I get really into the optimization.&nbsp; But then the game gets too easy, so I start looking for ways to make it harder while optimizing.&nbsp; Although I'm nowhere even remotely in this league, the highest achievement in computer RPGs (or so I gather from the Internet) is to be able to beat a game solo, in hard (&quot;Hell&quot;) mode.&nbsp; If it was just about making things easy, optimizers would only play in the easiest setting, right?Again, I'm sure there are people out there who want to be better than everybody else at the table, and &quot;beat&quot; the DM, etc.&nbsp; I wouldn't play with them.&nbsp; But for some (many?) of us, the &quot;arms race&quot; between better and better characters and harder and harder difficulty is exactly why optimization is fun.&nbsp; For the players and the DM.That doesn't mean everybody has to enjoy this mode, of course, but I do think your characterization of the mindset is way off base.&nbsp; Or, at least, only applies to a tiny minority.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Bill Zebub, post: 8381925, member: 7031982"] Then I think it's possible that you genuinely are not understanding part of the optimizer mindset, especially because you use the computer game example. Although I don't play a lot of video games, when I do I get really into the optimization. But then the game gets too easy, so I start looking for ways to make it harder while optimizing. Although I'm nowhere even remotely in this league, the highest achievement in computer RPGs (or so I gather from the Internet) is to be able to beat a game solo, in hard ("Hell") mode. If it was just about making things easy, optimizers would only play in the easiest setting, right? Again, I'm sure there are people out there who want to be better than everybody else at the table, and "beat" the DM, etc. I wouldn't play with them. But for some (many?) of us, the "arms race" between better and better characters and harder and harder difficulty [I]is exactly why optimization is fun[/I]. For the players [I]and[/I] the DM. That doesn't mean everybody has to enjoy this mode, of course, but I do think your characterization of the mindset is way off base. Or, at least, only applies to a tiny minority. [/QUOTE]

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