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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 3335051" data-attributes="member: 2011">First, I am not basing this off a theory. I am basing it off what the rules state.Second, you are not correct.In your opinion, opening the door surprises the monsters every single time. That is the problem with your POV from a rules perspective.What do the rules state?Now, the key question here is when is the start of the battle?The DM has two choices:1) Before the door is open.2) After the door is open.The DM can pick either one of these. Let's examine both:1) If the door is still closed and combat starts, that means the initiatives for PCs are rolled first before the door is opened. NPCs if they are unaware do not get to roll initiatives. That means that some PC has to open the door as a move action during the surprise round if the PCs want to enter the room during the surprise round.2) If the door is open (opening it was a pre-combat action by the PCs), then the NPCs get to roll to see if they are aware or not. It is the start of battle. By definition, the DM determines who is aware at the start of battle. Since the door is open, it is likely that some or all of the NPCs will be aware. If all of them fail their roll, there is a surprise round with no NPCs. If some of them fail their roll, there is a surprise round with some NPCs. If none of them fail their roll, there is no surprise round since everyone is aware.That's the rules.Given the rules as written (and not that one poorly written example), creatures at the start of combat are either aware, or they are not. Your POV is allowing the PC to take an action (opening the door) and the action itself is incapable of alerting the NPCs to danger. Hence, your POV is incorrect based on how the rules work.Let's take a different example. Let's say that there is no door, but the PCs are out of sight and surrounding the door.Instead of taking an "open the door" action, the PCs decide to cast a Bless and then rush in.From your POV, the act of casting the Bless (like the action of opening the door) is not capable of alerting the NPCs because the casting the spell IS the surprise.From my POV, if the NPCs hear the Bless being cast, they can react.Your POV does not make sense (from a RULES perspective) for this example, anymore than it makes sense for opening the door.</blockquote>

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