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Message: <blockquote data-quote="irdeggman" data-source="post: 3341291" data-attributes="member: 16285">For what its worth I also agree with KD and Nail - and the three of use seldom to never agree. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> What is the layout of the room?If the PCs opening the door can see the NPCs then the NPCs also have a view of the door.Changing the description of the room (i.e., opening the door) gives a Spot check - it could also gives a Listen check).Kicking in the door and not opening it slowly (the OP had the door being kicked in) would most definitely negate having to perform any checks since the PCs are not trying to be quiet anymore. So once the door is open everyone is aware of everyone else. At that moment any surprise ends and initiative is rolled. But if the PCs had readied actions then those actions go off before the combat round starts (part of the definition of a ready action).Now one of the options KD laid out was that in the "surprise round" the PCs who went before the the fighter who kicked open the door were delaying or readying actions for when the door was opened.If the door was not opened in the suprise round then the PCs can not ready actions (since they don't have a surprise round action that they can use to do it). And this does follow real life.  Being surprised in real life is different than being sruprised in D&D. Suprised in D&D has a very specific mechanic involved.In RL (using D&D mechanics) the door gets kicked in. Those inside are "surprised" by the sound but now get to roll initiative.  Those entering the room have alreeady gotten their weapons ready (readied actions, etc.).  Now those in the room must use precious actions to get their equipment ready in order to use it while those entering can save those actions to move and fight (or take full attacks with ranged weapons) - that those in the room can not do.Tactical advantage is in the number of actions required to be used.</blockquote>

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