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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
About the War Cleric......
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<blockquote data-quote="touc" data-source="post: 7392238" data-attributes="member: 19270"><p>I don't see any need to change it.</p><p></p><p><strong>Real world play:</strong> DM'd two War Cleric gamers in campaigns that ended at 14th and 8th levels. The description of <strong>soldier to general</strong> is <u>right on</u>. Neither were the primary fighter-type or main damage dealer, ever. Neither made an "optimal" melee build (a war cleric who buffs doesn't need a high wisdom). Both had concerns at low levels about the class and contacted me. <em>In summary, I think both wanted more a paladin than a cleric.</em> I discussed with both how clerics could influence battle with the right spell at the right time, and the right buff. Every buff was more damage done. If the Barbarian hits because of your <em>Bless,</em> or you Channel Divinity to give the Wizard +10 to his Bigby's spell, that's you doing damage and that's you furthering the ethos of War.</p><p></p><p><strong>But,</strong> I'll concede that the bonus attack has heavy influence on making a melee class, and there's a letdown when that alone adds, maybe, another 7 damage in a given battle. Still, we should think: when, in the history of any edition, has the <em>Cleric</em> <u>ever</u> been as great at fighting as the Fighter? They're already a full spellcasting class and with Heavy Armor + Shield, a pain to hit and capable of being the most adaptable caster out there. I don't see design flaw but rather player expectation that they're playing something that will wreak havoc like a Barbarian. Once you're past that, it works.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="touc, post: 7392238, member: 19270"] I don't see any need to change it. [B]Real world play:[/B] DM'd two War Cleric gamers in campaigns that ended at 14th and 8th levels. The description of [B]soldier to general[/B] is [U]right on[/U]. Neither were the primary fighter-type or main damage dealer, ever. Neither made an "optimal" melee build (a war cleric who buffs doesn't need a high wisdom). Both had concerns at low levels about the class and contacted me. [I]In summary, I think both wanted more a paladin than a cleric.[/I] I discussed with both how clerics could influence battle with the right spell at the right time, and the right buff. Every buff was more damage done. If the Barbarian hits because of your [I]Bless,[/I] or you Channel Divinity to give the Wizard +10 to his Bigby's spell, that's you doing damage and that's you furthering the ethos of War. [B]But,[/B] I'll concede that the bonus attack has heavy influence on making a melee class, and there's a letdown when that alone adds, maybe, another 7 damage in a given battle. Still, we should think: when, in the history of any edition, has the [I]Cleric[/I] [U]ever[/U] been as great at fighting as the Fighter? They're already a full spellcasting class and with Heavy Armor + Shield, a pain to hit and capable of being the most adaptable caster out there. I don't see design flaw but rather player expectation that they're playing something that will wreak havoc like a Barbarian. Once you're past that, it works. [/QUOTE]
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