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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ruemere" data-source="post: 5215810" data-attributes="member: 5515">50% chance to tumble translates into 50% chance of opponent getting an AoO, which in turn needs to hit you, and, even if hit, the damage caused may be unable to prevent you from completing your action.The odds are still on your side, only you may get hit from time to time (do not forget, that Rogues get d8 for hitpoints now, Toughness and Favored class bonuses can add nicely to your hitpoint total, too).The trade-off here is - if you do not build a dedicated tumbler, you will have to pay with your hitpoints the tax for being less than an accomplished professional.With onset of PFRPG, AoO lost a bit of importance. Unless you want to play a clone of Raistlin Majere, you are likely to have enough hitpoints to spare.Thanks to this change, party warriors are actually competent at hitting stuff. My advice for you would be not to try to tumble around single powerful monsters - all other guys are pretty safe.13th level Fighter/Rogue/Shadowdancer (don't really remember his class spread, though). His specialty is Stealth, not Acrobatics (i.e. I meant that he was rolling into 40s with regards to Stealth).Skill calculation:+13 for ranks+3 for class skill+4 for Dexterity (19 Dexterity now, 16 base, +2 for being Human, +1 for level)+6 for Skill Focus (Stealth)So, his Stealth without any items is at +26. If I remember correctly he also has an item granting +5 to Stealth checks.That's why I said that PFRPG's focus shifted a few levels up.Okies, let's look at hard numbers:CMD = 10 + Base attack bonus + Strength modifier + Dexterity modifier + special size modifierAcrobatics check = D20 + Skill ranks + Dexterity modifier + Class skill bonus + Skill focus bonusLet's compare components now:D20 vs 10 - By default results in 55% success chance. Not bad.Base attack bonus vs Skill ranks - Base attack bonus progression is either half one's level, 3/4 of one's level or equal to one's level. An acrobat is going to be better unless the opposing party is equal to Fighter in terms of BAB.Strength modifier + Dexterity modifier + special size modifiervs Dexterity modifier + Class skill bonus + Skill focus bonus- Hard to adjudicate this one, however unless you're fighting a BBEG or a good fighter, the chances are that the opposing party is unlikely to have high scores of both Strength and Dexterity. Size modifiers are not playing into the game unless your opponents are of size Huge or better (and in that case, the monster suffers from attack penalties). Sum of class skill bonus and skill focus bonus is equal to +6 or +9.So, the real answer to your question would be: your chances depend heavily on who you want to tumble past. If it's bigger than you, armored and has horns, you'd better to try not to attract its attention. That said, a skill bonus item and Dexterity bonus item would go a long way toward making you successful.For example, for low level you may want to carry <a href="http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/magicItems/wondrousItems.html#elixir-of-tumbling" target="_blank">Elixir of Tumbling</a> - lasts one hour, costs 125 GP to make, adds +10 to Acrobatics.Because I have seen a tumbler get past front liners and kill casters several times. Rogues with poisoned sneak attacks, acting in tandem...Because Tumble DC was static (DC 15), and once you got +14 on the skill, you did not really need to worry about opponents (unless you had a lot of diagonals to cross).Now, I realize that tumbling is more difficult, requires more attention to make it more reliable. However, under PFRPG you also get more feats, magic items do not require Xp expenditure and Cat's Grace spell is not difficult to acquire.Regards,Ruemere</blockquote>

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