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<blockquote data-quote="MrMyth" data-source="post: 4490784" data-attributes="member: 61155"><p>As someone who is a fan of saying yes (and as a player of a rogue who has done this very thing), here are my answers to your questions: </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>Using the chart on DMG page 42 (with or without the errata, as you prefer), find the appropriate DC for the level and use that. Possibly base the DC off the level of the enemy rather than that of the PC, if you want a bit more simulationism. </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>Certainly, unless the PC is willing to use a power in conjunction with the attempt, such as Tumble or something similar that avoids Opportunity Attacks. </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>Don't increase the DC - the initial roll determines whether or not they somersault over the enemy successfully. Instead, perhaps have them make a second roll if they get hit - and failing this one means they end up prone. </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>Not unless they have a basic attack that immobilizes an enemy it hits (or does some similar effect that would stop the PC), or they happen to be a fighter with the class feature that stops people hit by Opportunity Attacks. </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>Leave the initial DC as it is - the scaling DC based on level already is accounting for all the distractions caused by the enemy waving swords at them as they somersault overhead. </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>Certainly. </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>I'd say they can do it as part of a move action - which means they can also do it as part of a power like Tumble in order to avoid the risk of an Opportunity Attack. </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>I would say no - no more than a player can use a standard action to stride past an enemy without suffering an Opportunity Attack. </p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>The main difference is that this method requires a check to succeed and carries a risk of failure - and even then, doesn't overcome certain aspects of those powers. For example, I wouldn't let it negate Opportunity Attacks in any fashion, since you should need those specific powers to do so - thus, it doesn't take the place of Tumble.</p><p> </p><p>Meanwhile, Underfoot lets a halfling automatically move through an enemy without provoking. This somersault stunt would provoke an Opportunity Attack, and is not automatic - if they fail, I'd probably have them land prone next to the enemy. There is still a very clear advantage to having Underfoot.</p><p> </p><p>The trick is that while you should try to say "yes", it is up to you to set the guidelines - how difficult it will be, how much risk their will be, what benefit will be acquired from this action. As long as you thoughtful in doing so, there won't be any abuse of the stunt mechanics going on. </p><p> </p><p>You might also make it something that becomes harder to pull off if the enemy is expecting it. A player might do it once in a fight in the method recommended above - but if they do it again, the enemy is ready for it, and the DC goes up, or the enemy gets a bonus to hit, or something similar. Remember - you want your PCs trying new things, not finding a single useful stunt and defaulting to it at every opportunity. </p><p> </p><p>Anyway, none of the above answers are hard and fast rules - just how I would run it in a game I'm running, and along the lines of how my DM has run it for my own character. </p><p> </p><p>(Who has, several times, used Acrobatics to 'wall-run' past enemies, using Tumble as he does so to avoid any Opportunity Attacks.) </p><p> </p><p>(At which point, now surrounded by enemies and isolated from my allies, the enemies all tend to fall upon me and beat me unconscious.)</p><p> </p><p>(Playing a bold rogue is exciting, but sometimes these things can certainly backfire...)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="MrMyth, post: 4490784, member: 61155"] As someone who is a fan of saying yes (and as a player of a rogue who has done this very thing), here are my answers to your questions: Using the chart on DMG page 42 (with or without the errata, as you prefer), find the appropriate DC for the level and use that. Possibly base the DC off the level of the enemy rather than that of the PC, if you want a bit more simulationism. Certainly, unless the PC is willing to use a power in conjunction with the attempt, such as Tumble or something similar that avoids Opportunity Attacks. Don't increase the DC - the initial roll determines whether or not they somersault over the enemy successfully. Instead, perhaps have them make a second roll if they get hit - and failing this one means they end up prone. Not unless they have a basic attack that immobilizes an enemy it hits (or does some similar effect that would stop the PC), or they happen to be a fighter with the class feature that stops people hit by Opportunity Attacks. Leave the initial DC as it is - the scaling DC based on level already is accounting for all the distractions caused by the enemy waving swords at them as they somersault overhead. Certainly. I'd say they can do it as part of a move action - which means they can also do it as part of a power like Tumble in order to avoid the risk of an Opportunity Attack. I would say no - no more than a player can use a standard action to stride past an enemy without suffering an Opportunity Attack. The main difference is that this method requires a check to succeed and carries a risk of failure - and even then, doesn't overcome certain aspects of those powers. For example, I wouldn't let it negate Opportunity Attacks in any fashion, since you should need those specific powers to do so - thus, it doesn't take the place of Tumble. Meanwhile, Underfoot lets a halfling automatically move through an enemy without provoking. This somersault stunt would provoke an Opportunity Attack, and is not automatic - if they fail, I'd probably have them land prone next to the enemy. There is still a very clear advantage to having Underfoot. The trick is that while you should try to say "yes", it is up to you to set the guidelines - how difficult it will be, how much risk their will be, what benefit will be acquired from this action. As long as you thoughtful in doing so, there won't be any abuse of the stunt mechanics going on. You might also make it something that becomes harder to pull off if the enemy is expecting it. A player might do it once in a fight in the method recommended above - but if they do it again, the enemy is ready for it, and the DC goes up, or the enemy gets a bonus to hit, or something similar. Remember - you want your PCs trying new things, not finding a single useful stunt and defaulting to it at every opportunity. Anyway, none of the above answers are hard and fast rules - just how I would run it in a game I'm running, and along the lines of how my DM has run it for my own character. (Who has, several times, used Acrobatics to 'wall-run' past enemies, using Tumble as he does so to avoid any Opportunity Attacks.) (At which point, now surrounded by enemies and isolated from my allies, the enemies all tend to fall upon me and beat me unconscious.) (Playing a bold rogue is exciting, but sometimes these things can certainly backfire...) [/QUOTE]
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