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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Gruns" data-source="post: 5111760" data-attributes="member: 10312">My take...After DMing 4E exclusively since its release, I have found passive Perception to be pretty much useless. I know the Perception skills of my players, and I set the DCs. Soo... Essentially I KNOW if something will be spotted, or if it won't. Therefore, if I put a quote/unquote "secret" door in an area that I expect the players to find, I make the DC within range. If I put a secret door in an area that I don't want them to automatically find, I make it slightly higher than their best Passive check. For example, after the Big Bad Evil Guy fight, the PC's don't find the treasure they were sure was supposed to be here. A little snooping around (Perception roll, perception roll...) a-ha! There's a hidden trapdoor that happens to contain the fat loot.In the case of traps and whatnot, I almost always make the DC higher than their highest passive. However, I leave a clue or two for them to know that something is amiss, usually in the form of something that their Passive Perception can pick up. "The light reflects oddly off the wall to the left of this room, and you notice a smattering of little dimples and tiny holes throughout." (DC15) This may get them to actively look for, and find the myriad of poison dart traps on the right side of the room (DC18), ready to unleash their payload as soon as the pressure plate in the center of the room (DC20) is tripped.But all in all, I don't think passive Perception works as the designers intended for someone that writes their own adventures. I do see the benefit in bought adventures though, sort of, as it gives the writers a consitent DC target number. However, I think even then I'd prefer DC's to be "1 less than highest passive Perception in the group" or "2 higher than the highest..." etc... The trick is trusting your DM to know what is imperative to be Perceived automatically (or at all), and what isn't.Later!Gruns</blockquote>

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