Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Rocket your D&D 5E and Level Up: Advanced 5E games into space! Alpha Star Magazine Is Launching... Right Now!

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Scion" data-source="post: 1429061" data-attributes="member: 5777">I can play this game too. In a word, not on your life. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />The wizard is gaining the same amount of skill points he gained every other level. The dragon, however, gains many more from his hd. The amount of skill point difference here is extreme.The wizard has, at level 18, 21*(2+int mod) in skill pointsThe dragon has, at mature adult, 25*(6+int mod) in skill pointsDepending on the stats the wizard has the total skill points should lean heavily in the favor of the dragon. The wizard gains his same amount as always, but the sorc level barely changes his skill point total.Definately not enough to change the CR. Not even close.Let us take a look at those spell slots the sorc is gaining shall we?9th level spell slot: This means that the wizard can Become a dragon a dragon for a good amount of time everyday. Or something else, or cast a spell that has a chance of killing the dragon dead with a single check.The 7th level spell slot could also kill the dragon dead for that matter. Or do any number of other things. There are 'very' powerful spells you are talking about here. They are the things that legends are made of.If you think that a 7th and 9th level spell slot dont up the casters power by a pretty good amount then we can just stop talking now, we arent even playing the same game anymore.Yep, I just grabbed the first one. It should be a good enough example.So it gets one third, one second, and one first? These are going to do what exactly against a party of 15th level adventurers? Not a whole lot of anything. If the spells dont help increase the creatures fighting capability by a sizeable amount then it isnt worth a change in CR. Those spells are mainly flavorful, they wont do much of anything vs the pc's.Not to mention that this isnt true. He gains 3 3rd level spell slots and 1 second level slot to cast that day. He gains nothing extra from his charisma (it is only 14) and he gains 1 3rd level spell of his choice and 1 0th level spell. So he gets to choose a single 3rd level spell to cast up to 3 times that day. And he gets to pick a 0th level spell. None of this is enough to up the CR of this already very formidable creature.It is a 6th level sorcerer, they dont have 4th level spell slots. So no gain there.Fireball? 6d6 save for half? At level 15?? Excuse me while I yawn <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> His breath weapon does 14d4 (dc 26)!! vs 6d6 (dc 15). avg 35 vs avd 21. save dc 11 points lower. Which would you rather use as a dragon? your breath weapon or the spell? assuming you cant breathe this round, his natural attacks are far superior in most ways.For this creature when he gets the next age category his CR goes from 14 to 16. A step up of 2. With this step up he gets 3 hd which are FAR superiour to the sorcerers/wizards hd (d12, all good saves, good BAB), he gets 2 points of str, his breath weapon increases by 2 dice and goes up by a point of dc, his firghtful presence goes up by one point, he gains 3 points of natural armor, he gains an extra spell-like ability, his SR increases and he is now a 7th level spellcaster[/I]Can anyone here honestly say that the level of sorc to gain a single 3rd level spell, and pretty much nothing else, is worth HALF of that?????Very, very doubtful. No matter how good that single 3rd level spell might be it certainly isnt worth anywhere near half of what he gets for just being a dragon. The extra power gained from that level of sorc isnt even a blip on its radar of abilities. All of its natural abilities far outstrip it in every way, it wont increase this mighty foes combat abilities anywhere near to the point of an extra point of CR.</blockquote>

Verification