Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="N'raac" data-source="post: 6684805" data-attributes="member: 6681948">[MENTION=4937]Celebrim[/MENTION] - it's not an easy issue.&nbsp; On the one hand, &quot;player agency&quot; sums it up.&nbsp; On the other hand, if I envision my character to be a mighty warrior, I should not build a character with an 8 STR and take 1/2 BAB class levels, then complain that my player agency has been compromised because my vision of my character as a mighty warrior is not being realized in game.&nbsp; Why, then, should I be able to complain that my 8 WIS character with no ranks in Sense Motive should not be easily Bluffed by a fellow with a +15 Bluff roll?&nbsp; Perhaps I should properly play my character as, perhaps, still suspicious, but taken in by the specific bluff.&nbsp; Why do we have skill rank choices, and a Sense Motive skill, if those who choose to invest their character resources elsewhere are exempt from the consequences of lacking resources in that area?This is a branch of the &quot;we resolve negotiations with role playing not skill checks&quot; argument, of course, and I propose not to drag this thread into that debate (yet I will post this nonetheless).&nbsp; My simple preference is either we have mechanics for these matters, in which case we live within these mechanics (with some decisions on just how much impact they have and how long they last) or we remove the mechanics.&nbsp; It's not fair to tell the stuttering wallflower who invested in a 20 CHA and plugged all his skill points into social skills, selecting a class that emphasizes such skills, that &quot;we role play interaction&quot; and let the 8 CHA warrior with only combat skills, whose player is a smooth talker, be as or more successful in social interaction.We do not ask the warrior's player, who can barely rise from the couch, has not seen his feet in the 21st century, and needs two breaks to catch his breath when he climbs the stairs out of the basement, to role play his feats of herculean agility and endurance, while giving the wallflower combat skills for his 7th Dan Black Belt and years of experience with kenjutsu.&nbsp; You play a character.&nbsp; the character is often good at things you are not, and not as good as you at other things.&nbsp; Part of role playing is adopting that role, even where it is detrimental to the character.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="N'raac, post: 6684805, member: 6681948"] [MENTION=4937]Celebrim[/MENTION] - it's not an easy issue. On the one hand, "player agency" sums it up. On the other hand, if I envision my character to be a mighty warrior, I should not build a character with an 8 STR and take 1/2 BAB class levels, then complain that my player agency has been compromised because my vision of my character as a mighty warrior is not being realized in game. Why, then, should I be able to complain that my 8 WIS character with no ranks in Sense Motive should not be easily Bluffed by a fellow with a +15 Bluff roll? Perhaps I should [B]properly[/B] play my character as, perhaps, still suspicious, but taken in by the specific bluff. Why do we have skill rank choices, and a Sense Motive skill, if those who choose to invest their character resources elsewhere are exempt from the consequences of lacking resources in that area? This is a branch of the "we resolve negotiations with role playing not skill checks" argument, of course, and I propose not to drag this thread into that debate (yet I will post this nonetheless). My simple preference is either we have mechanics for these matters, in which case we live within these mechanics (with some decisions on just how much impact they have and how long they last) or we remove the mechanics. It's not fair to tell the stuttering wallflower who invested in a 20 CHA and plugged all his skill points into social skills, selecting a class that emphasizes such skills, that "we role play interaction" and let the 8 CHA warrior with only combat skills, whose player is a smooth talker, be as or more successful in social interaction. We do not ask the warrior's player, who can barely rise from the couch, has not seen his feet in the 21st century, and needs two breaks to catch his breath when he climbs the stairs out of the basement, to role play his feats of herculean agility and endurance, while giving the wallflower combat skills for his 7th Dan Black Belt and years of experience with kenjutsu. You play a character. the character is often good at things you are not, and not as good as you at other things. Part of role playing is adopting that role, even where it is detrimental to the character. [/QUOTE]

Verification