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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hriston" data-source="post: 6820803" data-attributes="member: 6787503"><p>[MENTION=6788736]Flamestrike[/MENTION], in response to your statement at the end of post #55, perhaps it's because DMs on both sides of this argument are uncomfortable telegraphing to their players that battle is about to start. You could say, "The ogre has decided to attack you. Roll initiative." But that would be reading the ogre's mind for your players, giving them information their characters shouldn't have. Or you could describe the ogre's face glazing over in a look of violent resolve, but even then you aren't really telling your players that combat is actually starting. The players know the ogre's decision to attack doesn't make combat happen in that very moment. A particularly devious ogre could decide to attack a party and wait several hours after the decision is made, making conversation, entertaining his guests until they have their guard down, before taking such actions as would necessitate rolling initiative. "The ogre grabs an evil looking morning star off the wall and swings it towards you. Roll initiative," tells a player explicitly that combat is starting. I think some DMs are uncomfortable with this because they are reluctant to telegraph outside of combat an action that will be resolved in combat. Perhaps they feel that doing so would somehow violate the discrete nature of the combat turn. The role of the DM, however, involves not only asking the players to make ability checks, of which an initiative check is an example, but also letting the players know what stakes are involved in failure and success. When making an initiative check, success is rolling higher than your opponent, failure is rolling lower. You won't know what's at stake unless you know you are in combat, and you won't know you are in combat unless it starts with you or a party member describing your character making an attack, or the DM describing an attack in progress being made by a hostile creature. There's no reason why these attacks can't be resolved in initiative order.</p></blockquote><p></p>

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