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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Particle_Man" data-source="post: 3331704" data-attributes="member: 892">The person saying that I am being a troll is being a troll.  Ignore him.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />The weaknesses of the Alienist have been detailed in this thread, so I won't go into them.The weakness of the Wu Jen?  Effectively they are Wizards without bonus feats.  The spell secret power for a spell gained at level 3 does not help that Wu Jen much at level 12, while the wizard that gains Empower Spell at level 5 can still use it effectively at level 15.  The wizard can also specialize to gain more spells per day than the Wu Jen.  The Wizard does not have to deal with either Taboos or an Alignment restriction.  The Wizard has a slightly better skill list.  The Wizard has way more wotc and 3rd party support than the Wu Jen.  The Wu Jen gets different spells, but with so many extra books coming out with new spells for Wizards and few to no new spells for Wu Jen, guess who wins that one?On the Wu Jen's side you get watchful spirit and elemental mastery, and a few spells that have not yet been duplicated on the wizard spell list (but as time goes by, and more books come out...).  Not bad, but not enough to balance out what the Wu Jen loses.If you want to take the Wu Jen anyway, I recommend you get Complete Mage as at least it gives *some* support for the Wu Jen (like feats to modify what the Watchful Spirit does).</blockquote>

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