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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Alignment, 4e, you, and your paladins.
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<blockquote data-quote="Imban" data-source="post: 4154936" data-attributes="member: 29206"><p>No, neither in D&D's alignment system nor my preferred alignment system. In my personal system, he would definitely not be able to be Good. Willingly doing overtly evil things, barring a grave mistake as to the nature of things you are doing, makes you evil. Even if you think what you're doing is Good. So going around killing cops and children makes you Evil, even if you're hallucinating that you are on a holy mission from Pelor, or you really believe that a society without children is the most beneficial society for humans.</p><p></p><p>Yes, this does mean that I take the tack that unlike 3e, a Paladin can be Dominated into murdering children without counting as a black mark against his alignment. We can possibly establish a scenario wherein someone Good is constantly gravely mistaken as to the nature of things he is doing and murdering children all the time, but the fact remains that he is still a Good person and only doing bad things because someone or something has acted to deceive him, not because he is Evil, amoral, or ax-crazy.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>As I said above, not in my system. According to the Book of Exalted Deeds, not in the official system either, unless the potential harm was clearly presented and willfully ignored.</p><p></p><p>Yes, this does mean that we can establish a scenario wherein someone Good is like Don Quixote, only worse, and constantly does things that are good on the surface but which inadvertently result in suffering because he is just plain stupid. I would suggest that outside of parody purposes, this mostly does not exist, whereas people who make mistakes occasionally do.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That sounds like something a Chaotic person would want to do in my system, yes.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>To actually succeed at doing Good requires a lot of things. Same with doing Evil, establishing Order, or dissolving society into Chaos.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well, as long as spells like Holy Word exist, you can "reveal" the alignment of a target. Of course, that's also attempted murder at the very least.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Imban, post: 4154936, member: 29206"] No, neither in D&D's alignment system nor my preferred alignment system. In my personal system, he would definitely not be able to be Good. Willingly doing overtly evil things, barring a grave mistake as to the nature of things you are doing, makes you evil. Even if you think what you're doing is Good. So going around killing cops and children makes you Evil, even if you're hallucinating that you are on a holy mission from Pelor, or you really believe that a society without children is the most beneficial society for humans. Yes, this does mean that I take the tack that unlike 3e, a Paladin can be Dominated into murdering children without counting as a black mark against his alignment. We can possibly establish a scenario wherein someone Good is constantly gravely mistaken as to the nature of things he is doing and murdering children all the time, but the fact remains that he is still a Good person and only doing bad things because someone or something has acted to deceive him, not because he is Evil, amoral, or ax-crazy. As I said above, not in my system. According to the Book of Exalted Deeds, not in the official system either, unless the potential harm was clearly presented and willfully ignored. Yes, this does mean that we can establish a scenario wherein someone Good is like Don Quixote, only worse, and constantly does things that are good on the surface but which inadvertently result in suffering because he is just plain stupid. I would suggest that outside of parody purposes, this mostly does not exist, whereas people who make mistakes occasionally do. That sounds like something a Chaotic person would want to do in my system, yes. To actually succeed at doing Good requires a lot of things. Same with doing Evil, establishing Order, or dissolving society into Chaos. Well, as long as spells like Holy Word exist, you can "reveal" the alignment of a target. Of course, that's also attempted murder at the very least. [/QUOTE]
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