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Message: <blockquote data-quote="NoOneofConsequence" data-source="post: 484303" data-attributes="member: 5400">Very cool thread Edena - just the sorts of things I like to discuss.As far as medieval ethics versus modern (or proto-modern) there is a need to be careful in our views. The medieval period is hardly homogenous - there's a lot of variety in the past. For example - your quote from the story Shogun, this is a situation that was pretty strict under the Tokugawa Shogunate (a period of high stability and order) but in the era immediately previous, the Sengoku Jidai(sp?), it was possible for peasants to rise to very high levels. The Taisho of Japan before Tokugawa Ieyasu became Shogun was Toyotomi Hideyoshi, a peasant.Getting to the main issue - did people believe things to be good which we consider to be evil? The ancient Greeks held the free interchange of ideals to be a high virtue, and while kings did try to censor philosophers who criticised them, it was the king who was considered to be in the wrong by the populace, not the philosopher.Much of our ideals of good and right derive from philosophical and religious systems that are thousands of years old. The fact that kings or the like claimed the right to slay peasants just 'cause they felt affronted by them was often argued as legally acceptable, but not often was it considered "good". In fact, in many cases, medieval cultures had stronger notions of good and evil than the modern world.Also, we need to be careful when we say that because a historical source makes a statement of morality like "It is sweet and fitting to die for one's country." that's what people thought. Until very recently in history, written histories were made for the wealthy and powerful and they tended to paint the rich and powerful in the best possible light. A historian who writes a history that says the king is wrong for being a tyrant better be ready to flee from the king - even though most of the people might agree with him.I think I've gotten a bit lost here. I'll post and see if it makes sense to others.</blockquote>

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