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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jeremy Ackerman-Yost" data-source="post: 355946" data-attributes="member: 4720">Just some points about a few characters and people:King Arthur: Some people have him NG.  In some versions of the story, he invented Rule of Law (as opposed to Rule of Force) in England.  In most versions, he ALWAYS keeps his word.  And in most versions he invents a code of chivalry to bring order to England.  Even in the least Lawful-themed, heavily Celtic versions, he's a tactician and the forger of great armies.  This guy is REALLY Lawful Good.The Jedi: All of the Jedi were LG, except for Qui-Gon and Luke Skywalker.  In fact, there's a case to be made that the reason the Jedi ended up being exterminated was because they were LAWFUL good  when the Will of the Force wanted them to be lawful GOOD, or Neutral Good.  Qui-Gon was NG.  He had a reputation as a rebel among the ultra-lawful Jedi, but fundamentally, he was governed by compassion, which is the heart and soul of Neutral Good.  Luke Skywalker started out Chaotic Good (like his old man) and became Neutral Good.  Personally, my theory is that Lucas intended Qui-Gon to be the perfect Jedi.  We are to assume that Luke ultimately grows up to be the spitting philosophical image of Qui-Gon sometime in the aftermath of RotJ.  (I won't bring up where most of the books took him, as it leans heavily in the direction of garbage)Batman: LG (sometimes LN) - In some versions, he's almost Captain America.  In other versions, he was basically insane, but his insanity hinged on keeping his two identities COMPLETELY separate with elaborate rules and constructions.  i.e. They're "Bruce" and "Dick" in the Mansion, but they're "Batman" and "Robin" in the Batcave, and Robin better watch out if he slips and uses the name "Bruce" when they're in the cave.  But despite being basically insane, there's nothing Chaotic about Batman.  He lives and dies by a rigid code.  The fact that his code doesn't consistently conform to society's laws doesn't make it any less Lawful at its core.Shakespeare's characters: As Celebrim pointed out, most literature has at least SOME philosophical conflict.  Shakespeare's characters especially, were often in the midst of alignment changes.  They're generally hard to pigeonhole.  Macbeth was evil by the end of the play, but he didn't start out that way (his wife did, but I don't want to get into Western Literature and it's handling of women at this point).  Brutus started out rather good, but I think that ultimately Will Shakespeare would agree with the placement Brutus received in the Inferno.American politicians: Some of the really early ones were LG or CG, but in the long run, most of them have been LN.  We sneak a good guy in there periodically, but as a general rule, presidents have been all about keeping the country in relative order and covering their posterior regions.Here's a thorny one: Jesus of Nazareth.  Please keep in mind as you read the following section that this is OPINION.  I'm not belittling anyone's beliefs here, just stating my opinion.  For the record, I'm a Christian myself, though I'm still searching for the denomination that got it right.  I've read his Book, and Jesus spoke pretty plainly.  I fail to understand the origin of all the confusion about what the man said.Looking back at Jesus now, he seems to be Neutral Good.  But if you think about it, he was VERY revolutionary.  He was re-interpreting God's Law all over the place.  And, despite what most Christians will tell you, he was throwing large chunks of it out.  GOD's Law, which had been codified and laid out for thousands of years by prophets and sages, and here's this guy was telling people, "No, no, no.  You don't do it that way.  This is how you do it." and "Forget about all those rules, just follow THIS one..."  Even today, people get thrown in the nuthatch for ideas a lot less against accepted societal beliefs than "Love your neighbor as yourself."  At any rate, Jesus was Chaotic Good.EDITED to remove needlessly inflamatory comments that my antihistamine-addled brain thought were reasonable at 1:30 in the morning.  Sorry.</blockquote>

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