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<blockquote data-quote="Vaalingrade" data-source="post: 8443533" data-attributes="member: 82524">That's the problem. That's why I hate it.Things like lying, having piercings and being fat, but NOT torturing someone into Goodness, being a living plague that only hurts people you hate or being undead with the serial numbers filed off.The BoXDs were the worst 3e books even ahead of Savage Species for a reason.People have different views on morality. If we could just leave it out of game entirely, it would be a shining city on a hill of gaming and enjoyment. I game with a diverse group and there's very little difference between 'immoral', 'amoral' and 'evil' in a lot of peoples' reckoning.I've got a buddy who is maximum Gygax in terms of how to treat 'evil' monsters. We get along fine when he runs games because he has neither the inclination nor the mechanical backing to punish me for not murdering orcs or killing villains I convert to make sure they can't backslide. As much as it pains him, I still took over that kobold settlement and converted them to a medieval Army Corps of Engineers.On the flipside, I similarly don't have a stick to beat him with when he plays a guy who shows no mercy to his enemies even if I personally find it distasteful. Not that I'd use it if I was given one.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Vaalingrade, post: 8443533, member: 82524"] That's the problem. That's why I hate it. Things like lying, having piercings and being fat, but NOT torturing someone into Goodness, being a living plague that only hurts people you hate or being undead with the serial numbers filed off. The BoXDs were the worst 3e books even ahead of Savage Species for a reason. People have different views on morality. If we could just leave it out of game entirely, it would be a shining city on a hill of gaming and enjoyment. I game with a diverse group and there's very little difference between 'immoral', 'amoral' and 'evil' in a lot of peoples' reckoning. I've got a buddy who is maximum Gygax in terms of how to treat 'evil' monsters. We get along fine when he runs games because he has neither the inclination nor the mechanical backing to punish me for not murdering orcs or killing villains I convert to make sure they can't backslide. As much as it pains him, I still took over that kobold settlement and converted them to a medieval Army Corps of Engineers. On the flipside, I similarly don't have a stick to beat him with when he plays a guy who shows no mercy to his enemies even if I personally find it distasteful. Not that I'd use it if I was given one. [/QUOTE]

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