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Alignment Question - Chaotic Neutral or Chaotic Evil?
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<blockquote data-quote="steeldragons" data-source="post: 5688682" data-attributes="member: 92511"><p>I concur on the "jerk"...but then, it is more than likely that a CN character <em>would </em>come across as a jerk. If the player's a jerk, then unfortunately there's really nothing we can do to help you.</p><p></p><p>For the PC, however, here's what I got fer ya...</p><p></p><p>This is how I define CN for my game/world:<p style="margin-left: 20px">[FONT=&quot]<em>CHAOTIC NEUTRAL (CN): "The Free Spirit" A character choosing to be chaotic neutral is, by no means, insane (though certainly could be as disturbed as any other alignment). Unpredictable, perhaps, but not insane. They are the ultimate examples of "freedom." They hold no ethical qualms or chains to upholding "order" or respect for the "law" of authority. Morally, they are freed of the constraints of "good" or "evil" feeling no obligation to the bettering of society or its downfall.</em>[/FONT]</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">[FONT=&quot]<em> They simply wish to "be." To be allowed to pursue their interests and desires without judgments, without contempt, without (as above) obligation to anyone but themselves. They are not necessarily interested in seeking to harm anyone and they are definitely against anyone seeking to harm them/interfere with their pursuits. So if harming someone becomes necessary to further their goals (including, say, self preservation), so be it. </em>[/FONT]</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">[FONT=&quot]<em> A CN character is not about to constrain/submit themselves to someone else's arbitrary rules. Nor will he accept the judgement of anyone by themselves. "Good" or "evil" only matter in so far as they promote or interfere with their personal freedom to pursue their life. I think many, many rogues of all walks of life would choose to be CN: Bards, swashbucklers, thieves (probably </em><em>not in a guild, but could be)...also rangers, barbarians, revolutionaries of all kinds and others who value freedom above order. </em>[/FONT]</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p><p>[FONT=&quot] <span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">Here is </span>[/FONT]the definition as sited by ENworlder @<u><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=8313" target="_blank">cperkins</a></u> from his most excellent redo of the 1e Players Handbook for his homebrew (you can grab it for yourself here: <a href="http://www.adnd3egame.com/documents/ADD3primeless.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.adnd3egame.com/documents/ADD3primeless.pdf</a> . It's a big file so be warned. and his definition is a bit clearer/more elegantly put than my own):<p style="margin-left: 20px"><em>Chaotic Neutral, “Free Spirit”: A chaotic neutral character follows his whims. He is an individualist first and last. He values his own liberty but doesn‘t strive to protect others‘ freedom. He avoids authority, resents restrictions, and challenges traditions.</em></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><em></em></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><em>A chaotic neutral character does not intentionally disrupt organizations as part of a campaign of anarchy. To do so, he would have to be motivated either by good (and a desire to liberate others) or evil (and a desire to make those different from himself suffer). A chaotic neutral character may be unpredictable, but his behavior is not totally random.</em></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><em></em></p><p>His definition of Chaotic Evil is also pretty much the same as mine, so I'll just post his again:<p style="margin-left: 20px"><em>Chaotic Evil, “Destroyer”: A chaotic evil character does whatever his greed, hatred, and lust for destruction drive him to do. He is hot-tempered, vicious, arbitrarily violent, and unpredictable. If he is simply out for whatever he can get, he is ruthless and brutal. If he is committed to the spread of evil and chaos, he is even worse. His plans may be worked out well in advance, but their implementation will often be haphazard, and any group he forms is likely to be poorly organized. Typically, chaotic evil creatures can be made to work together only by force, and their leader lasts only as long as he can thwart attempts to topple or assassinate him. Chaotic evil is sometimes called ―demonic because demons are the epitome of chaotic evil.</em></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><em></em></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><em>Chaotic evil represents the destruction not only of beauty and life but also of the order on which beauty and life depend.</em></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><em></em></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p><p>So I'd say, sounds like the Barbarian is acting in a fairly clear cut Chaotic Neutral way (in so far as CN can be clear cut)...and being a jerk. Sorry.</p><p></p><p>The party can is the PC down and have a conversation about his behavior, but from a CN character, I wouldn't be expecting a whole lot of altering/constraining his behavior to suit the party's desires. </p><p></p><p>What alignment is your character? Maybe you could just kill him in his sleep. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p><p>--SD</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="steeldragons, post: 5688682, member: 92511"] I concur on the "jerk"...but then, it is more than likely that a CN character [I]would [/I]come across as a jerk. If the player's a jerk, then unfortunately there's really nothing we can do to help you. For the PC, however, here's what I got fer ya... This is how I define CN for my game/world:[INDENT][FONT="][I]CHAOTIC NEUTRAL (CN): "The Free Spirit" A character choosing to be chaotic neutral is, by no means, insane (though certainly could be as disturbed as any other alignment). Unpredictable, perhaps, but not insane. They are the ultimate examples of "freedom." They hold no ethical qualms or chains to upholding "order" or respect for the "law" of authority. Morally, they are freed of the constraints of "good" or "evil" feeling no obligation to the bettering of society or its downfall.[/I][/FONT] [FONT="][I] They simply wish to "be." To be allowed to pursue their interests and desires without judgments, without contempt, without (as above) obligation to anyone but themselves. They are not necessarily interested in seeking to harm anyone and they are definitely against anyone seeking to harm them/interfere with their pursuits. So if harming someone becomes necessary to further their goals (including, say, self preservation), so be it. [/I][/FONT] [FONT="][I] A CN character is not about to constrain/submit themselves to someone else's arbitrary rules. Nor will he accept the judgement of anyone by themselves. "Good" or "evil" only matter in so far as they promote or interfere with their personal freedom to pursue their life. I think many, many rogues of all walks of life would choose to be CN: Bards, swashbucklers, thieves (probably [/I][I]not in a guild, but could be)...also rangers, barbarians, revolutionaries of all kinds and others who value freedom above order. [/I][/FONT] [/INDENT][FONT="] [FONT=Verdana]Here is [/FONT][/FONT]the definition as sited by ENworlder @[U][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=8313"]cperkins[/URL][/U] from his most excellent redo of the 1e Players Handbook for his homebrew (you can grab it for yourself here: [URL]http://www.adnd3egame.com/documents/ADD3primeless.pdf[/URL] . It's a big file so be warned. and his definition is a bit clearer/more elegantly put than my own):[INDENT][I]Chaotic Neutral, “Free Spirit”: A chaotic neutral character follows his whims. He is an individualist first and last. He values his own liberty but doesn‘t strive to protect others‘ freedom. He avoids authority, resents restrictions, and challenges traditions. A chaotic neutral character does not intentionally disrupt organizations as part of a campaign of anarchy. To do so, he would have to be motivated either by good (and a desire to liberate others) or evil (and a desire to make those different from himself suffer). A chaotic neutral character may be unpredictable, but his behavior is not totally random. [/I][/INDENT]His definition of Chaotic Evil is also pretty much the same as mine, so I'll just post his again:[INDENT][I]Chaotic Evil, “Destroyer”: A chaotic evil character does whatever his greed, hatred, and lust for destruction drive him to do. He is hot-tempered, vicious, arbitrarily violent, and unpredictable. If he is simply out for whatever he can get, he is ruthless and brutal. If he is committed to the spread of evil and chaos, he is even worse. His plans may be worked out well in advance, but their implementation will often be haphazard, and any group he forms is likely to be poorly organized. Typically, chaotic evil creatures can be made to work together only by force, and their leader lasts only as long as he can thwart attempts to topple or assassinate him. Chaotic evil is sometimes called ―demonic because demons are the epitome of chaotic evil. Chaotic evil represents the destruction not only of beauty and life but also of the order on which beauty and life depend. [/I] [/INDENT]So I'd say, sounds like the Barbarian is acting in a fairly clear cut Chaotic Neutral way (in so far as CN can be clear cut)...and being a jerk. Sorry. The party can is the PC down and have a conversation about his behavior, but from a CN character, I wouldn't be expecting a whole lot of altering/constraining his behavior to suit the party's desires. What alignment is your character? Maybe you could just kill him in his sleep. :) --SD [/QUOTE]
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