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<blockquote data-quote="Hardhead" data-source="post: 705560" data-attributes="member: 2844">By the way, I'm also pretty sure you couldn't remove all the flavor no matter what.&nbsp; The d20 system is naturally designed to be a&nbsp; heroic game, for instance.&nbsp; You couldn't run a really gritty game, for instance.&nbsp; If I wanted to run a more gritty/real-life game, for instance, where any melee fighter, even a master swordsman, who fought eight men at one time would loose, I couldn't do it without altering the d20 rules.In real life, NO ONE can beat eight people at once in a swordfight, unless the opponents are so green they don't know which end to poke into the other guy.But in d20, a 16th level fighter could mop the floor with eight sixth level characters.&nbsp; So I can't run my gritty game without altering the rules for d20.&nbsp; And if I do that, the system is no longer capable of running a heroic game where a powerful swordmaster can take down a horde of &quot;lackey swordsmen.&quot;&nbsp; The underlying rules tell you a lot about the game you'll be playing.&nbsp; You can't build a flavorless game system.&nbsp; I've never seen it done, and I don't think it can be done.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hardhead, post: 705560, member: 2844"] By the way, I'm also pretty sure you couldn't remove all the flavor no matter what. The d20 system is naturally designed to be a heroic game, for instance. You couldn't run a really gritty game, for instance. If I wanted to run a more gritty/real-life game, for instance, where any melee fighter, even a master swordsman, who fought eight men at one time would loose, I couldn't do it without altering the d20 rules. In real life, NO ONE can beat eight people at once in a swordfight, unless the opponents are so green they don't know which end to poke into the other guy. But in d20, a 16th level fighter could mop the floor with eight sixth level characters. So I can't run my gritty game without altering the rules for d20. And if I do that, the system is no longer capable of running a heroic game where a powerful swordmaster can take down a horde of "lackey swordsmen." The underlying rules tell you a lot about the game you'll be playing. You [i]can't[/i] build a flavorless game system. I've never seen it done, and I don't think it can be done. [/QUOTE]

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