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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 6191121" data-attributes="member: 4937">No, it's not.&nbsp; There is not in the categorization of motives, deeds, and so forth into buckets labeled 'law', 'chaos', 'good', or 'evil' any real debate over ethics - any more than if we were shuffling them into 'blue', 'red', 'green' and 'yellow'.&nbsp; If we were having a serious debate over ethics, I might argue that several of those labels have no real value - or at least no real ethical value.&nbsp; Remember, I have from the start insisted that despite the superficial labeling, I'm making no normative judgment in favor or against any belief or mode of behavior.&nbsp;&nbsp; It may be that the NPC espousing the NE ethical code, briefly and oversimplifying, &quot;The world is evil.&nbsp; Good is an illusion.&nbsp; If were it not an illusion, it's nothing that actually exists in this world.&nbsp; Good is as bad as evil, or worse.&nbsp; There is no salvation for this world.&nbsp; If a person does well by opposing evil, then one would do best by opposing the world, life, and existence.&quot;&nbsp;&nbsp; Whether you believe that or not, there is a disputable argument involved as to whether that is correct.&nbsp;&nbsp; However, it is not disputable that that code is in the bucket NE, because as DM I'm the one that has decided what each bucket contains. I have no intention of overruling someone else's opinion as to whether something is right or wrong.&nbsp; But for the purposes of a game, the player must accept what bucket contains what beliefs.&nbsp; In their own game if it seems fitting to them, they may arrange things differently and I wouldn't be able to gainsay them.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 6191121, member: 4937"] No, it's not. There is not in the categorization of motives, deeds, and so forth into buckets labeled 'law', 'chaos', 'good', or 'evil' any real debate over ethics - any more than if we were shuffling them into 'blue', 'red', 'green' and 'yellow'. If we were having a serious debate over ethics, I might argue that several of those labels have no real value - or at least no real ethical value. Remember, I have from the start insisted that despite the superficial labeling, I'm making no normative judgment in favor or against any belief or mode of behavior. It may be that the NPC espousing the NE ethical code, briefly and oversimplifying, "The world is evil. Good is an illusion. If were it not an illusion, it's nothing that actually exists in this world. Good is as bad as evil, or worse. There is no salvation for this world. If a person does well by opposing evil, then one would do best by opposing the world, life, and existence." Whether you believe that or not, there is a disputable argument involved as to whether that is correct. However, it is not disputable that that code is in the bucket NE, because as DM I'm the one that has decided what each bucket contains. I have no intention of overruling someone else's opinion as to whether something is right or wrong. But for the purposes of a game, the player must accept what bucket contains what beliefs. In their own game if it seems fitting to them, they may arrange things differently and I wouldn't be able to gainsay them. [/QUOTE]

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