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<blockquote data-quote="Thomas Shey" data-source="post: 8696431" data-attributes="member: 7026617">CL, I think we've had enough positive interactions to know I'm not going to just bust you for no reason or because I consider you some kind of enemy, but I've got to tell you that at some point this starts to come across as deliberate lack of engagement.Yes, sometimes it can be ambiguous.&nbsp; Many things in life are not clear-cut, but we still talk about them because ambiguity does not mean you cannot make effort to look at something and go &quot;Does this look like it matters?&nbsp; Would it matter to me?&nbsp; Have I seen signs it matters to most players?&quot;You've described a situation.&nbsp; Whether you deliberately emphasize it or not, there's going to be things that that look like they might make a difference.&nbsp; People start to debate which of those they should do.Is it that difficult when this happens to tell them &quot;Whether you go up into the hills, down through the valley, or boat up the river isn't likely to effect much.&quot;&nbsp; Then they can decide if they want to spend time on it or just tell you that you're going to the other side of the hills and not worry about it and spend mental energy on something that is (at best, and maybe not even this) just about color.Its not just about not being actively going &quot;You have these four options, which one do you take?&quot; when none of them matter, but not letting players assume there are decisions there which, in terms of anything in game play, really aren't.Was the research likely to be useful?&nbsp; Basically, would anything play out differently if they'd all stayed home and had lunch?And you can tell people if that's true (if the mechanics don't already tell you that, which it does in the second case).Of course it is.&nbsp; But is that a reason for someone else not to say &quot;I think Technique X is a bad idea?&quot;&nbsp; Or &quot;I'd object strenuously to someone using this technique in a game I'm in?&quot;&nbsp; If so, why?Again, honestly, the fact there are words that describe doing something (and if &quot;deception&quot; is not an accurate description of someone acting like a decision that doesn't really make a difference does, I'd like to know why) that seem insulting seems like a case of &quot;If you find that word insulting, why are you doing it?&quot;&nbsp; I mean, I get there's semantic loading being a thing, but its hard for me to think of a term to describe that process that isn't insulting if &quot;deception&quot;.&nbsp; People pay to have stage mages decieve them.&nbsp; Their skill at doing sleight-of-hand (which is deception) is part of what people are there for.So what word that actually describes the process would you find acceptable?&nbsp; And why does your feelings here matter more than those who dislike it?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Thomas Shey, post: 8696431, member: 7026617"] CL, I think we've had enough positive interactions to know I'm not going to just bust you for no reason or because I consider you some kind of enemy, but I've got to tell you that at some point this starts to come across as deliberate lack of engagement. Yes, sometimes it can be ambiguous. Many things in life are not clear-cut, but we still talk about them because ambiguity does not mean you cannot make effort to look at something and go "Does this look like it matters? Would it matter to me? Have I seen signs it matters to most players?" You've described a situation. Whether you deliberately emphasize it or not, there's going to be things that that look like they might make a difference. People start to debate which of those they should do. Is it that difficult when this happens to tell them "Whether you go up into the hills, down through the valley, or boat up the river isn't likely to effect much." Then they can decide if they want to spend time on it or just tell you that you're going to the other side of the hills and not worry about it and spend mental energy on something that is (at best, and maybe not even this) just about color. Its not just about not being actively going "You have these four options, which one do you take?" when none of them matter, but not letting players assume there are decisions there which, in terms of anything in game play, really aren't. Was the research likely to be useful? Basically, would anything play out differently if they'd all stayed home and had lunch? And you can tell people if that's true (if the mechanics don't already tell you that, which it does in the second case). Of course it is. But is that a reason for someone else not to say "I think Technique X is a bad idea?" Or "I'd object strenuously to someone using this technique in a game I'm in?" If so, why? Again, honestly, the fact there are words that describe doing something (and if "deception" is not an accurate description of someone acting like a decision that doesn't really make a difference does, I'd like to know why) that seem insulting seems like a case of "If you find that word insulting, why are you doing it?" I mean, I get there's semantic loading being a thing, but its hard for me to think of a term to describe that process that isn't insulting if "deception". People pay to have stage mages decieve them. Their skill at doing sleight-of-hand (which is deception) is part of what people are there for. So what word that actually describes the process would you find acceptable? And why does your feelings here matter more than those who dislike it? [/QUOTE]

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