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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hassassin" data-source="post: 5750630" data-attributes="member: 6675228">On that whole abilities and defenses thing.Ok, here is a vision of 4 abilities and their effects on a character and well as the four defenses, and a small look at combat. It's probably way contradictory to what you, [MENTION=92511]steeldragons[/MENTION], have in mind, but maybe it's good for some ideas.(Warning, long post ahead!)Edit: I wrote this before seeing your previous two posts.AbilitiesRolled 4d6 drop lowest or for grittier play 4d4 add all. Either in order or assigned, however the group likes to play.Strength (Str): bonus/penalty to hp, melee attacks, damage, fortitude defense.Dexterity (Dex): bonus/penalty to ranged attacks, physical and reflex defense.Intellect (Int): bonus/penalty to skill points, spell attacks, mage bonus spells.Presence (Pre): bonus/penalty to spell damage, cleric bonus spells, will defense.All bonuses or penalties also apply to skills based on that ability as well as some class abilities.Ability modifiers are looked up from one of the tables below. I'd use the first, but the second emphasizes extreme abilities more. In either case the modifier for humans ranges from -4 to +4.First:[sblock](2-)3: -44-5: -36-7: -28-9: -110-11: +012-13: +114-15: +216-17: +318(-19): +4(For higher/lower scores add/subtract 1 per two ability points.)[/sblock]Second:[sblock]3: -44: -35: -26:-17-14: +015: +116: +217: +318: +4(For higher/lower scores add/subtract 1 per ability point.)[/sblock]DefensesBased on class, ability and gear. All defenses start at 10, unless otherwise specified.Groups that like to have the player roll all dice can start defenses at +0 and treat them as modifiers to a defense roll: 1d20 + defense modifier. In this case you can either roll the opposed attack or just add 11 to the attack modifier to get a target number for the defense roll.Physical (Phy): defense against attacks that would cause physical damage. You add armor and shield bonuses, as well as Dex modifier to physical defense.Reflexes (Ref): defense against attacks that only need to touch you, like many spell effects. You add your shield bonus, as well as Dex modifier to your reflexes.Fortitude (Fort): defense against life-draining attacks, poisons, and tiring. You add your Str modifier to your fortitude.Will (Will...): defense against mental attacks, like mind-affecting spells and fear. You add your Pre modifier to your will.Core classes' defense modifiers (+4 or -4 to some defenses):[sblock]Good: +4 to this defenseAverage: +0 to this defensePoor: -4 to this defenseCleric: Phy, Ref, Fort average, Will good.Fighter: Phy, Ref average, Fort good, Will poor.Thief: Phy, Ref good, Fort poor, Will average.Mage: Phy, Ref average, Fort poor, Will good.In multi-classing you take the better modifier for each defense, but there will be other costs to multi-classing.[/sblock]Armors and shields:[sblock]Shield: +2 Phy and RefLeather: +2 PhyChain: +4 PhyPlate: +6 Phy (-2 Ref if you like that sort of thing)Proficiencies:Cleric: leather, chainFighter: allMage: noneThief: leather, shieldThere's still a theme of fours, since leather + shield (thief) is +4, chain (cleric) is +4 and plate + shield (fighter) is +8. Those would be the most common cases.Yes, this means a thief and a fighter have the same Phy, but for different reasons. I don't think that's a problem, but if you do either make plate +8 or remove the thief's shield proficiency.[/sblock]Combat basicsAttack roll: 1d20 + attack modifier against relevant defense.As written above, the attack modifier includes either Str, Dex or Int modifier, depending on whether the attack is a melee attack, a ranged attack or a spell attack.Normal melee and ranged attack are against Phy. Combat maneuvers like trip are against Ref. Spells and monsters' special attacks may be against any defense as noted in the thing's description.Damage depends on the weapon/spell used. If using the weapon table <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5748642-post54.html" target="_blank">here</a>, proficiencies are below:[sblock]Cleric: tiny, small and mediumFighter: allMage: tinyThief: tiny and small[/sblock]Thieves should also have some sort of precision-damage special ability.Leveling upThere are two options here. The first is to have a level dependent bonus on both attacks and defenses. This is the simplest way. Example table:[sblock]Level: Bonus1: -2: +1 attack3: +1 attack, +1 defense4: +2 attack, +1 defense5: +2 attack, +2 defenseetc.These bonuses apply to *all* attacks, whether magical or non-magical. When multi-classing, look up the numbers for all classes individually and add the modifiers.[/sblock]Another option is to only give bonuses to attack and defense from feats and specific class abilities. I'm not sure which is a better option.In any case, there could be a system of four "tiers" of four levels. For example, a 1-4 level character would be "adventurer", 5-8 "hero", 9-12 "paragon", 13-16 "epic". Or something similar.Ok, running out of gas now. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /></blockquote>

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