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<blockquote data-quote="clearstream" data-source="post: 8283236" data-attributes="member: 71699">Something to draw your attention to is that the context of game qua game or D&amp;D as game has been used for SP. For there to be a separation then between game and story such that the OP's dilemma arises, there must be a tautological assumption that story is ruled out from game (or that we are speaking of game only to the extent that it excludes story). My general view is one of gameful-narrative: I think game is a form of story... one we have not as yet mastered.There are then some disconnected assumptions about how limited and constraining a ruleset is, and how suitable it is for SP. An idea that tighter rules equate to greater SP. I think this can only amount to an idea that more enforceable rules equate to greater SP, which is a matter of human limitations and one may experience greater SP in VTTs such as Fantasy Grounds.But still, if we resist the urge to divide game qua game out from narrative, then we can't properly answer the OP's question. Hence I feel a better way to frame SP is in game-as-boardgame... which raises a second obstacle to answering the OP because by now (and even, in my experience, back then) we are very far past such constraints on our RP gaming! SP can't produce conflict with our gameful-narrative while it sits in a context that excludes it: the OP's question answers itself, and we find we can have no opinion on the matter.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="clearstream, post: 8283236, member: 71699"] Something to draw your attention to is that the context of game qua game or D&D as game has been used for SP. For there to be a separation then between game and story such that the OP's dilemma arises, there must be a tautological assumption that story is ruled out from game (or that we are speaking of game only to the extent that it excludes story). My general view is one of gameful-narrative: I think game is a form of story... one we have not as yet mastered. There are then some disconnected assumptions about how limited and constraining a ruleset is, and how suitable it is for SP. An idea that tighter rules equate to greater SP. I think this can only amount to an idea that more enforceable rules equate to greater SP, which is a matter of human limitations and one may experience greater SP in VTTs such as Fantasy Grounds. But still, if we resist the urge to divide game qua game out from narrative, then we can't properly answer the OP's question. Hence I feel a better way to frame SP is in game-as-boardgame... which raises a second obstacle to answering the OP because by now (and even, in my experience, back then) we are very far past such constraints on our RP gaming! SP can't produce conflict with our gameful-narrative while it sits in a context that excludes it: the OP's question answers itself, and we find we can have no opinion on the matter. [/QUOTE]

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