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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Sylrae" data-source="post: 4524859" data-attributes="member: 48520">*sigh* you just don't get it. The problem, is that the 3e multiclass system doesnt work well with casters AS IS. a Fighter 10/Wizard 10 has all the things that a Wizard 10 has, plus what a Fighter 10 has. Unfortunately A Fighter10/Wizard10 is nowhere near as good as a Fighter10/Rogue10.In 3e/3.5e D&D, Noncaster's progress in a linear fashion. Casters progress Exponentially. which means, that level 2 of wizard is more than level 1 wizard x2. Level 2 wizard is more like level 1 wizard * 2.5. Not Multiclassing makes a wizard be about as good as a fighter (a bit worse at low levels, a bit better at high levels, and around equal in mid levels).But when you multiclass with a caster, the 3.5e system makes your character useless if you do anymore than take a 1-2 level dip unless you took prcs to compensate for it. prcs in this case are just a clutch to band-aid how <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> multiclassing is for casters. logically, any given 15th level character should be roughly equally useful.A cleric 7 wizard 8 should be as useful as a wizard 15 or a cleric 15, even though its not as powerful at casting in either. but the exponential design in caster classes means that under the regular system, a cleric7/wizard8 is about as useful as a wizard 12, and maybe about as useful as a cleric 12. Its like you missed out on 3 levels completely, because as you gain levels, the things youre missing out on become worth more and more.what if I wanted to make a bard4/sorc4/wiz4/cler4/drd4. That character should be as useful as any 20th level version of any of the 5 (albeit not as powerful, given the trade for versatility). However, that character would be complete crap. I'd be surprised if they were as useful as a 14th level character, let alone 20th.You seem to have an 'if it ain't broke, dont fix it' attitude about almost all of 3e, but the thing is, in alot of areas, it is broke, so we're trying to fix it (hence 3.5e revisionists.....). You're also a bit more critical of our ideas than we are of yours. Youre changing LA because you feel that what you gain from an LA is less than what you gain from a class level (if I understood your argument correctly). The same issue presents itself with caster classes and multiclassing. a multiclassed caster sucks compared to anything else, with the exception of a caster with la and racial HD. And while I agree with you that the LA system is suboptimal, I dont really think your system is much of an improvement, it seems like its almost the same as savage progression, except instead of breaking it all down into something like a class, you give it on normal class levels, and then have them take levels where they get nothing... and your system wont account for racial HD. I dont know how you can see the problem with LA and not see the problem with casters, cause theyre virtually the same problem. Am I saying I know how to fix LA? No. Can we Fix Casters? yes. Will we eventually fix LA? hopefully. If you look at it, you'll notice Monsters with LA and racial hit dice who are non-casters that are used as players, are much more useful than those who are caster-ish. This would also address that issue.A minotaur Fighter 12 is a 20th level character. An illithid Wizard 5 is a 20th level character. The Minotaur is a much better character (not just more powerful, but better all around).Why? because at level 15 the first 5 levels of wizard are considerably less useful than they would have been for levels 1-5. Contrary to what simple addition tells you, an Illithid Wizard 5 is not a level 20 character. It's a level 17 (18 tops) character.</blockquote>

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