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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DerHauptman" data-source="post: 3104464" data-attributes="member: 39988">Tumble is the rogue's thing - taking it away because its too good i.e. a 3rd level rogue (with max ranks ans some focus/synergies) under the current rules can tumble circles round a 15th level fighter with an almost guarantee of success seems like a good idea on the surface but it opens a whole can of worms.  If the tumble rule needs fixed to balance the "realism factor" of the high level fighter not being able to even get a chance to hit a med-low level rogue is good.Why then would the fighters high BAB not need adjusted to balance the "realism factor" of the rogue who's thing is his ability to tumble to avoid the high power - high damage fighter to get his stick in.  I mean we could say hell - ok he gets the AoO but only at a minus (insert # here i.e. tumble roll) to his attack roll. The result is the same except you now have more rolls and more confusing add ons and house rules to remember.  Which is more important and has more sanctity tumble or the insane BAB - both are RAW, both are the particular classes shticks.  Take them away and you gotta take everyones shticks away....And as for those worried about loosing the WOW factor of the BBEG to a tumbling thief do you also worry about loosing his wow factor to the denigrating mage, or the miracle working cleric, the feat wielding fighter etc.  The tumble rule is not perfect - but what is.  The game is balanced for the most part in general not in each category.     Let the people chose and play their classes to deny them their abilities to make the wow factor higher is the basis of the US vs THEM complaint.</blockquote>

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