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<blockquote data-quote="davedoty" data-source="post: 5518129" data-attributes="member: 6669597">I know that thread title is horrendous, but I couldn't think of a way to boil my subject down to a few words and still be coherent.I've always loved the rp concept of the bard as a wandering minstrel/ storyteller, but never liked the class design itself (for the usual, well-hashed out reasons.)It recently occurred to me that the best way to have my cake and eat it too would simply be to play another class, but have bard be the profession.&nbsp; In other words, to take my stats from Class X, but have the character with those abilities and stats be a wandering storyteller, and play him as such.My question here is twofold: what would be the best class(es) to lend themselves to that type of role-playing, and what tweaks might I try to sell my GM on to improve them?If I wanted to stay with spellcasting, a cleric or favored soul whose &quot;deity&quot; is the magic of language or myth or one of those &quot;devoted to a concept&quot; ideas sprung to mind.&nbsp; If I wanted to have a non-magical wandering minstrel, rogue and swashbuckler came to mind as someone whose abilities would complement what I want to play.&nbsp; Any other suggestions?As far as tweaks, the main thing that came to my mind is that while Bardic Knowledge isn't one of the most powerful abilities, it's one that would really make my bard feel more like a Bard, if you know what I mean.&nbsp; AFAIK, there's no way for non-bards to acquire that ability without going homebrew, although if there is, I'd love to hear about it.If I'm going to try to sell something homebrew, the most logical approach would probably be to try to trade a class feature that doesn't fit my character concept for bardic knowledge.&nbsp; Trading Turn Undead or Trapfinding/Trap Sense for Bardic Knowledge would probably be a step down in terms of the crunchy, but would make the character more like what I want it to be.I don't like bringing poorly-developed, half-formed ideas to my GMs, so wanted to get some feedback so that I could bring a more solid proposal forward.&nbsp; Any thoughts would be appreciated.&nbsp; (Although if you're going to bring a defense of the standard bard class, you've got your work cut out for you.)</blockquote>

[QUOTE="davedoty, post: 5518129, member: 6669597"] I know that thread title is horrendous, but I couldn't think of a way to boil my subject down to a few words and still be coherent. I've always loved the rp concept of the bard as a wandering minstrel/ storyteller, but never liked the class design itself (for the usual, well-hashed out reasons.) It recently occurred to me that the best way to have my cake and eat it too would simply be to play another class, but have bard be the profession. In other words, to take my stats from Class X, but have the character with those abilities and stats be a wandering storyteller, and play him as such. My question here is twofold: what would be the best class(es) to lend themselves to that type of role-playing, and what tweaks might I try to sell my GM on to improve them? If I wanted to stay with spellcasting, a cleric or favored soul whose "deity" is the magic of language or myth or one of those "devoted to a concept" ideas sprung to mind. If I wanted to have a non-magical wandering minstrel, rogue and swashbuckler came to mind as someone whose abilities would complement what I want to play. Any other suggestions? As far as tweaks, the main thing that came to my mind is that while Bardic Knowledge isn't one of the most powerful abilities, it's one that would really make my bard feel more like a Bard, if you know what I mean. AFAIK, there's no way for non-bards to acquire that ability without going homebrew, although if there is, I'd love to hear about it. If I'm going to try to sell something homebrew, the most logical approach would probably be to try to trade a class feature that doesn't fit my character concept for bardic knowledge. Trading Turn Undead or Trapfinding/Trap Sense for Bardic Knowledge would probably be a step down in terms of the crunchy, but would make the character more like what I want it to be. I don't like bringing poorly-developed, half-formed ideas to my GMs, so wanted to get some feedback so that I could bring a more solid proposal forward. Any thoughts would be appreciated. (Although if you're going to bring a defense of the standard bard class, you've got your work cut out for you.) [/QUOTE]

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