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Alternative magic systems for 5e? [+]
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<blockquote data-quote="DeviousQuail" data-source="post: 9208923" data-attributes="member: 7025431"><p>Cool Down Spells: When you cast a spell you cannot cast that spell again for X amount of time. In many ways it is similar to 4e's AEDU without having the same distinct line between spells. It would need to be retuned for table top and D&D style magic, but I don't see why it couldn't work. </p><p></p><p>Cool Down Magic: Similar to above, but the cool down affects your ability to cast any magic. Want to cast Fireball? Okay, but you better have a back up plan for the next X rounds if it fails to kill your targets. I like the feel of this style better than the previous one. However, it raises some balance questions that are much easier to solve with the individual spell cool downs. </p><p></p><p>Recharge: Like a dragon's breath weapon, after you cast a spell you must roll dice to see if you can do it again. This is probably more of a variant of Cool Down than it's own thing. </p><p></p><p>Powering Up Magic: Not sure if there is a better name for this one. If you're at all familiar with DragonBall Z then you know where I'm going with this. If you want to cast more powerful magic you must first power up. In D&D terms I could see this being done by having spells require an action or bonus action be spent powering up first. This could be a sliding scale where a 1st level character needs to use an action to power up a 1st level spell while a 3rd level wizard only needs a bonus action and a 5th level wizard didn't need to power up at all to cast 1st level spells. </p><p></p><p>Those are all simple ideas that would need a lot of tinkering to work in D&D. I haven't done that tinkering so I can't speak to it beyond the idea stage. The good news is I have one homebrew system that I've actually playtested in 5e. It worked once people got the hang of it and the beauty of it is that it mechanically works for just about anything in D&D. I originally made it as a way to track and affect Fighter resources. But it also worked with Paladins and Warlocks.</p><p></p><p>The <s> Stamina</s> Magic Dice System:</p><p>You have a pool of dice. Whenever you cast a spell you must reduce a die by at least one step. The steps being d12 -> d10 -> d8 -> d6 -> d4 -> Exhausted. The number of dice as well as their maximum value increase over time. Some spells might require larger reductions. And no you can't cut corners. If a spell has a 2 step cost then you need at least one d6 in your pool because a d4 can only be reduced one step. A short rest might restore one die to its starting value while a long rest restores them all. That's the elevator pitch. </p><p></p><p>[SPOILER="Longer explanation spoilered for length"]</p><p>What makes the use of dice necessary in this system is that when you roll for things like damage, healing, or other effects you use your magic dice to roll. Whatever cost the spell has must be paid by a die used in the roll. This can lead to interesting trade offs when your pool starts getting smaller from use. For spells without a die roll you just choose a die to take the cost and you're done. </p><p></p><p>As an example let's say a wizard starts their day with 6d8s. They get into a fight and decide to cast Chromatic Orb. That's a 3dX spell with a cost of 1 (and a 50g component cost) so the wizard rolls 3d8s, dealing that much damage on a hit. Now the wizard has 5d8s and 1d6. After a slog of a fight the wizard is down to 1d8, 1d6, and 1d4. If they choose to cast Chromatic Orb again they roll 1d8+1d6+1d4 and deal that much damage. After casting the spell and rolling the dice the wizard must choose which die to reduce by 1. Reducing the d4 means the die is exhausted and can't be used anymore. The next casting of Chromatic Orb is now 1d8+1d6. Reducing the d8 gives us 2d6+1d4 and reducing the d6 gives us 1d8+2d4. Not to mention how you would use those dice for other spells.</p><p></p><p>That's the simplest way to use the mechanic. But you can spice it up in many ways. For instance I made Magic Missile require you to use your three smallest dice. Fireball had a cost of "spread 3" meanding it reduced three dice by one instead of the normal one die by three. Revivify required you to Exhaust a die of d6 or larger. When you upcast a spell you reduce one additional die by one for each level above the normal level. Cantrips don't have a die cost, but if all your d8s have been reduced to d4s your cantrips won't hit as hard. </p><p></p><p>Generally speaking spells of level 1-2 have a cost of one, 3-4 costs two, and levels 5+ cost three plus an additional one for every level above 5. Obviously costs of six or higher require more than one die to pay the cost since a die can only be reduced five times at most if it's a d12. But we know that all spells aren't created equally so something like Fireball has a cost higher than normal for its level.</p><p></p><p>Why do I like this system?</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">It rewards higher level spellcasters by making their spells hit harder due to their larger dice. I grew up on the Baldur's Gate games and liked that a 5th level wizard's magic missile hit harder than a lower level wizard.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">It simulates getting tired over the course of a day. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">It can easily interact with other resources. Just give that resource a cost and you're set. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Instead of 5e's exhaustion rules (imo they're bad) just make the PC exhaust a die and reduce their maximum number of dice each time. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You don't have to remember which size of dice a spell uses, just the number of dice it uses. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You can visually track how much magic you have left by just leaving your available dice in front of you and swapping them out as needed.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The tactics for which die gets reduced its fun (to me at least).</li> </ul><p>What were some hiccups I found? </p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You need a lot of dice on hand.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Choosing which die to reduce might cause decision paralysis. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Spells that normally use more dice than a player has have to be reworked. I changed fireball from 8d6 to 3d6+15 for instance.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">There are a couple of sneaky limiters on the use of higher level spells, but it still has some of the same problems spell points has. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Some of my players thought it was more complex than spell slots. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Differentiating Stamina and Magic dice is needed to prevent some pretty nasty edge cases (ahem... action surge).</li> </ul><p>[/SPOILER]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="DeviousQuail, post: 9208923, member: 7025431"] Cool Down Spells: When you cast a spell you cannot cast that spell again for X amount of time. In many ways it is similar to 4e's AEDU without having the same distinct line between spells. It would need to be retuned for table top and D&D style magic, but I don't see why it couldn't work. Cool Down Magic: Similar to above, but the cool down affects your ability to cast any magic. Want to cast Fireball? Okay, but you better have a back up plan for the next X rounds if it fails to kill your targets. I like the feel of this style better than the previous one. However, it raises some balance questions that are much easier to solve with the individual spell cool downs. Recharge: Like a dragon's breath weapon, after you cast a spell you must roll dice to see if you can do it again. This is probably more of a variant of Cool Down than it's own thing. Powering Up Magic: Not sure if there is a better name for this one. If you're at all familiar with DragonBall Z then you know where I'm going with this. If you want to cast more powerful magic you must first power up. In D&D terms I could see this being done by having spells require an action or bonus action be spent powering up first. This could be a sliding scale where a 1st level character needs to use an action to power up a 1st level spell while a 3rd level wizard only needs a bonus action and a 5th level wizard didn't need to power up at all to cast 1st level spells. Those are all simple ideas that would need a lot of tinkering to work in D&D. I haven't done that tinkering so I can't speak to it beyond the idea stage. The good news is I have one homebrew system that I've actually playtested in 5e. It worked once people got the hang of it and the beauty of it is that it mechanically works for just about anything in D&D. I originally made it as a way to track and affect Fighter resources. But it also worked with Paladins and Warlocks. The [S] Stamina[/S] Magic Dice System: You have a pool of dice. Whenever you cast a spell you must reduce a die by at least one step. The steps being d12 -> d10 -> d8 -> d6 -> d4 -> Exhausted. The number of dice as well as their maximum value increase over time. Some spells might require larger reductions. And no you can't cut corners. If a spell has a 2 step cost then you need at least one d6 in your pool because a d4 can only be reduced one step. A short rest might restore one die to its starting value while a long rest restores them all. That's the elevator pitch. [SPOILER="Longer explanation spoilered for length"] What makes the use of dice necessary in this system is that when you roll for things like damage, healing, or other effects you use your magic dice to roll. Whatever cost the spell has must be paid by a die used in the roll. This can lead to interesting trade offs when your pool starts getting smaller from use. For spells without a die roll you just choose a die to take the cost and you're done. As an example let's say a wizard starts their day with 6d8s. They get into a fight and decide to cast Chromatic Orb. That's a 3dX spell with a cost of 1 (and a 50g component cost) so the wizard rolls 3d8s, dealing that much damage on a hit. Now the wizard has 5d8s and 1d6. After a slog of a fight the wizard is down to 1d8, 1d6, and 1d4. If they choose to cast Chromatic Orb again they roll 1d8+1d6+1d4 and deal that much damage. After casting the spell and rolling the dice the wizard must choose which die to reduce by 1. Reducing the d4 means the die is exhausted and can't be used anymore. The next casting of Chromatic Orb is now 1d8+1d6. Reducing the d8 gives us 2d6+1d4 and reducing the d6 gives us 1d8+2d4. Not to mention how you would use those dice for other spells. That's the simplest way to use the mechanic. But you can spice it up in many ways. For instance I made Magic Missile require you to use your three smallest dice. Fireball had a cost of "spread 3" meanding it reduced three dice by one instead of the normal one die by three. Revivify required you to Exhaust a die of d6 or larger. When you upcast a spell you reduce one additional die by one for each level above the normal level. Cantrips don't have a die cost, but if all your d8s have been reduced to d4s your cantrips won't hit as hard. Generally speaking spells of level 1-2 have a cost of one, 3-4 costs two, and levels 5+ cost three plus an additional one for every level above 5. Obviously costs of six or higher require more than one die to pay the cost since a die can only be reduced five times at most if it's a d12. But we know that all spells aren't created equally so something like Fireball has a cost higher than normal for its level. Why do I like this system? [LIST] [*]It rewards higher level spellcasters by making their spells hit harder due to their larger dice. I grew up on the Baldur's Gate games and liked that a 5th level wizard's magic missile hit harder than a lower level wizard. [*]It simulates getting tired over the course of a day. [*]It can easily interact with other resources. Just give that resource a cost and you're set. [*]Instead of 5e's exhaustion rules (imo they're bad) just make the PC exhaust a die and reduce their maximum number of dice each time. [*]You don't have to remember which size of dice a spell uses, just the number of dice it uses. [*]You can visually track how much magic you have left by just leaving your available dice in front of you and swapping them out as needed. [*]The tactics for which die gets reduced its fun (to me at least). [/LIST] What were some hiccups I found? [LIST] [*]You need a lot of dice on hand. [*]Choosing which die to reduce might cause decision paralysis. [*]Spells that normally use more dice than a player has have to be reworked. I changed fireball from 8d6 to 3d6+15 for instance. [*]There are a couple of sneaky limiters on the use of higher level spells, but it still has some of the same problems spell points has. [*]Some of my players thought it was more complex than spell slots. [*]Differentiating Stamina and Magic dice is needed to prevent some pretty nasty edge cases (ahem... action surge). [/LIST] [/SPOILER] [/QUOTE]
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