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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Yair" data-source="post: 1191287" data-attributes="member: 10913">True, true.Yes, but this check is kind of wierd. Not "d20ish".Yes... I suppose it is.Good points. I have to agree the cleric's powers do seem to stray too high too quickly.No. That would require too much work  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />  We could base the DC on the CR, but this would not be very "d20ish" and will undermine the "beuty" of the mechanic.Ponders...Well, let's take a look than, shall we? Taking a post from another thread,Using Clr lvl + cha bonus as maximum HD would mean that a cleric with level equal to the monster's CR could not turn it in many cases. (To be precise, assuming +4 Cha bonus, these are the Zombie (gray render, minotaur), wraith (dread), ulgarstasta, skeletaon (ettin), ragewind, quth-maren, nightwing, nightwalker, nightcrawler, mhorg, jahi, grave crawler, famine spirit, effigy, death bringer, crawling head, corpse gatherer, banshee, abyssal ghoul). Having a lower Cha will just make this worse.In fact, except at low-levels where the differences are still small, this is basically the problem of CR going up as HD/2, whereas level=CR. I suggest using cleric level x 2 + cha mod might work better, but I have to go to work, so I can't check this out right now. Later  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> Now, this counts the TR as HD, which is not quite what we have suggested. But if turning is to be maxed at a certain HD, that actually makes sense. And I ain't got time to make the table myself <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /></blockquote>

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