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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Grayhawk" data-source="post: 1191589" data-attributes="member: 11288">Hm, the mechanic seems pretty similar to a Dispel Magic check.I was thinking of making it even simpler by having the check be d20 + cleric level vs a DC of undead's will save + 11.(I know that this removes the cha bonus, but if you use Clr lvl + cha bonus as maximum HD, it's still pretty important.)I agree. It doesn't seem right to use CR in a game mechanic like this.But that's true of the existing system as well, where the highest HD you'd ever be able to turn is cleric level +4 (on a good roll). But of course, this is one of the things we're trying to rectify...With the risk of making it too complicated, you could have a seperate mechanic for turning a single undead vs turning an area, like so:When turning just one creature, the maximum HD affected is = (Clr lvl + cha bonus)x2. This way you'd have to be an 8th level cleric with a cha of 14 to turn a CR 6 Gray Render Zombie as opposed to 18th level. I'd be interested in seeing what you come up with. My feeling though, is that this will make turning too powerful.If you use both HD and will save as determining factors, I'm not sure if TR should be applied to both. Maybe only will save, as it seems that the problem with the current system is that some HD are too high to be turned, even though the undead's CR often is less than half their HD. But then again, are there even any undead with high HD compared to their CR that have TR?Anyway, to use the Spectre again, a cha 14 cleric would have to be 5th level and roll a 15 to turn a Spectre (if using max HD = cleric level + cha bonus, and having the cleric make a level check vs 11 + will save + TR).If also applying the TR to the HD, the cleric would have to be 7th level, at which point he would only have to roll a 13 to turn the Spectre.</blockquote>

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