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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 4802994" data-attributes="member: 2011">There are issues with that as well.The game is pretty much designed over a set of abilities. When you make those abilities moot, it defeats the purpose of the game.As an example, we had a trap that required a high Acrobatics or Athletics roll to get out of. The party Invoker, the Ranger's pet, the Cleric, and the Bard all got stuck in the trap. The Bard eventually got out, but the Invoker, Cleric and pet did not due to not having those skills trained until the Rogue came over and disarmed the trap. The Rogue was busy in combat, so she couldn't come over for many rounds (something like 5 or 6, most of the combat).The issue here is that two players were out of combat because they did not have the proper tools to get out of the trap. This has taught me as a DM to give a bonus to the roll each round in this type of situation and to let the player know that the PC is making progress. There has to be normal ways to eventually succeed or the game becomes unfun.Ditto for Orcus. IMO.Unlike normal monsters, a foe like Orcus typically should not be killed by the PCs. He goes screaming back into the Abyss or something, but there are reasons to make him not a normal foe. Your bane idea might be something used to permanently kill him or some such (or drive him away for a century or millennium or whatever), but it shouldn't be required to fight him.</blockquote>