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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Am I missing something? What happened to spell circles in 4e?
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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 4982932" data-attributes="member: 82106"><p>No, the rules never assumed that spell levels had to do with anything else besides when you could acquire a spell, but a lot of campaigns did do the fairly obvious thing and tied levels into some sort of guild hierarchy or whatnot, which is cool. Actually I've always seen it more with clerics than with wizards. The old D&D rules did sort of imply that clerics were part of some hierarchy based on levels. Wizards it seems like were always thought of as more loners. </p><p></p><p>4e really tries hard to break the time honored tradition though of a society where everyone has levels in classes and important people are high level. The base assumption is more like society is organized pretty much like in the real world where people are good at their jobs but unless your job actually involves something like fighting you probably don't have much in the way of combat ability.</p><p></p><p>So the old fashioned idea of a kingdom is "the king is the 14th level fighter because he's important" and in 4e the king is just as likely to be a level X minion where X is whatever the DM decides makes sense. Maybe the king is a noble and trained with weapons and he's a level 14 minion. Maybe he's a warrior king and he's a level 8 NPC Soldier. He could be King Conan the superhero and be a level 14 fighter like in the old days. </p><p></p><p>The same would go for any other NPCs. The head of the wizard's guild could be a high level wizard. He could also be a guy that has a really high Arcana skill and is really good at politics and doesn't know squat about combat spell casting, though he might still know some high level rituals etc. Again he could be a minion, though probably a fairly high level one, as he really doesn't know anything about fighting. Of course the EVIL wizard's guild, where you get to be top dog by frying the competition may be a different story...</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 4982932, member: 82106"] No, the rules never assumed that spell levels had to do with anything else besides when you could acquire a spell, but a lot of campaigns did do the fairly obvious thing and tied levels into some sort of guild hierarchy or whatnot, which is cool. Actually I've always seen it more with clerics than with wizards. The old D&D rules did sort of imply that clerics were part of some hierarchy based on levels. Wizards it seems like were always thought of as more loners. 4e really tries hard to break the time honored tradition though of a society where everyone has levels in classes and important people are high level. The base assumption is more like society is organized pretty much like in the real world where people are good at their jobs but unless your job actually involves something like fighting you probably don't have much in the way of combat ability. So the old fashioned idea of a kingdom is "the king is the 14th level fighter because he's important" and in 4e the king is just as likely to be a level X minion where X is whatever the DM decides makes sense. Maybe the king is a noble and trained with weapons and he's a level 14 minion. Maybe he's a warrior king and he's a level 8 NPC Soldier. He could be King Conan the superhero and be a level 14 fighter like in the old days. The same would go for any other NPCs. The head of the wizard's guild could be a high level wizard. He could also be a guy that has a really high Arcana skill and is really good at politics and doesn't know squat about combat spell casting, though he might still know some high level rituals etc. Again he could be a minion, though probably a fairly high level one, as he really doesn't know anything about fighting. Of course the EVIL wizard's guild, where you get to be top dog by frying the competition may be a different story... [/QUOTE]
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Am I missing something? What happened to spell circles in 4e?
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