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Message: <blockquote data-quote="robertliguori" data-source="post: 3876948" data-attributes="member: 47776">One point to consider:You can't balance something by looking at its average case.  You need to look at the upmost limits of what it can do, because when it's used in a system, it will be used optimally.Take the teleport capacity of any number of exemplar outsiders.  Wimpy little CR 2 and 4 archons have Greater Teleport.  At will."Aha," the developers said, "but it's balanced, see?  They can only take along 50 pounds of gear, and no other creatures!""Great." said the players.  "Heard of these neat things called bags of holding?  You can schlep an entire party into one of the bigger ones, have the wizard's planar familiar zap us to a secluded location a day's travel or so from where we want to be, and then walk the rest of the way, for anyplace in the world not covered with Forbiddance or Hallow.  And this is at level 7."There exist counters to conditions like Stunned or Dazed; inflicting them on your way through a teleport simply means that warforged wizards will rule the day.Really, the problem with teleport is that at the core, beating through the defenses of a castle or dungeon is not an ideal strategy.  There's really no way around the fact that if a dungeon is meant to challenge the PCs and use up their resources, then the smart thing to do is not to play the dungeon's game.  Finding out when your opponent is weak and then circumventing his defenes to strike when you are strong is a really good strategy; it doesn't matter so much if it's Scry or Commune, or whether or not Invisibility and Wind Walk are combined to produce the effect of a Teleport.  If the characters are seeking goals beyond glory and the experience of dungeon-crawling, then they will often come up to solutions to problems totally at odds with the traditional dungeon-crawling experience.  I view this as a good thing, myself.  On the other hand, I have played characters that have strip-mined the Tomb of Horrors.  I'm probably not totally representative of the D&D gamer population.</blockquote>

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