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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FireLance" data-source="post: 4924440" data-attributes="member: 3424">Quite frankly, I am not sure that we have a mechanical need for an ability score system at all. In the past, it may have been necessary because there were few secondary variables (e.g. skill modifiers) so the six ability scores became the way to determine what a character could be expected to be good at: for example, a strong character might be able to leap across a pit, a dexterous character might be able to walk a tightrope, an intelligent character might know a bit of lore, and a charismatic character might be able to influence an NPC.In 4e, ability scores are hardly ever referenced directly. In most cases, they only have an indirect effect, e.g. modifying the attack bonus, damage bonus, defense, skill modifier, etc. Replace all instances of [Ability] modifier with a fixed number (say +2 at 1st level, +3 at 8th, etc.) and the game will still function relatively well. Why do you need Strength, Dexterity, Intelligence and Charisma when you have Athletics, Acrobatics, History and Diplomacy?From the roleplaying angle, I do still see some benefit in retaining the ability scores, as a shorthand for describing the character. However, I think the flow of cause and effect should flow in the opposite direction. A strong character isn't good at making melee attacks. Instead, a character who is good at making melee attacks is strong. You don't create a character with 16 Strength and decide to make him a fighter. You create a fighter and his class choice gives him a +6 bonus to Strength (or you could describe him as more wiry than muscular and give him +3 Strength +3 Dexterity instead, or as a clever fighter that relies as much on his wits as he does on his physical abilities and give him +2 Strength +2 Dexterity +2 Intelligence). You aren't good at Athletics because you are strong. You are strong because you are good at Athletics (if you are trained in Athletics, you get +2 Strength). You don't have a high Initiative modifier because you have a good Dexterity. If you pick the Improved Initiative feat, you get +2 Dexterity.Now, one argument that I can think of for retaining the six ability scores as more than just a role-playing tool is that they help to mechanically differentiate PCs of the same race and class. What other benefits might there be to retaining the mechanical effects of ability scores?</blockquote>

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