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<blockquote data-quote="JohnSnow" data-source="post: 3878834" data-attributes="member: 32164">Well, I'll use a combination of D&amp;D definitions and real-world ones.&quot;Altruism - Unselfish concern for the welfare of others; Selflessness.&quot; - American Heritage Dictionary.On the subject of Paladins...&quot;A paladin who ceases to be lawful good...loses all paladin spells and abilities.&quot; - 3.5 PHB, p. 44.Loses. Not &quot;has (them) taken away by her deity for failing to follow her oaths.&quot; After all, what is the deity getting from the Paladin?As far as the Shield of the Sun, I interpret that as a way for &quot;the powers that be&quot; to make sure it hasn't fallen into the wrong hands. The quest is a test to consistently prove your worthiness.Quite frankly I'm floored you can ascribe any motivation but selfish to a quid-pro-quo pact for powers.And yes, I realize that in the real-world, &quot;good&quot; people make these kind of deals all the time. That doesn't mean that the deal itself isn't motivated by selfish concerns. Doing something for someone else and expecting them to pay you back is NOT selfless. Ergo, it's not good.On the other hand, if you're one of those people who believes all acts are either &quot;good&quot; or &quot;evil,&quot; then we're just going to have to agree to disagree.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="JohnSnow, post: 3878834, member: 32164"] Well, I'll use a combination of D&D definitions and real-world ones. "Altruism - Unselfish concern for the welfare of others; Selflessness." - [i]American Heritage Dictionary.[/i] On the subject of Paladins... "A paladin who ceases to be lawful good...loses all paladin spells and abilities." - 3.5 PHB, p. 44. Loses. Not "has (them) taken away by her deity for failing to follow her oaths." After all, what is the deity getting from the Paladin? As far as the Shield of the Sun, I interpret that as a way for "the powers that be" to make sure it hasn't fallen into the wrong hands. The quest is a test to consistently prove your worthiness. Quite frankly I'm floored you can ascribe any motivation but selfish to a quid-pro-quo pact for powers. And yes, I realize that in the real-world, "good" people make these kind of deals all the time. That doesn't mean that the deal itself isn't motivated by selfish concerns. Doing something for someone else and expecting them to pay you back is NOT selfless. Ergo, it's not good. On the other hand, if you're one of those people who believes all acts are either "good" or "evil," then we're just going to have to agree to disagree. [/QUOTE]

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