NOW LIVE! Today's the day you meet your new best friend. You don’t have to leave Wolfy behind... In 'Pets & Sidekicks' your companions level up with you!

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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 8397723" data-attributes="member: 82106">Yeah, I think I got off the track of my thought on that post. She built the E-Paladin because it was simple, and it kinda was simple to build. It worked OK OOTB. OTOH 4e just always calls to you to get into the swamp. so she eventually summoned up the Build Guru (a player who had DDI and liked fiddling, he was also the one with the crazy halfling that always used Topple Over). They collectively sauced up the character with some MCing, I forget the exact details. I think [USER=2093]@Gilladian[/USER] with her Axe Dwarf was pretty close to the only one that was pretty vanilla, and I seem to recall even that character needed a bit of specific feat 'sauce' to keep up with things (it was a different group from the paladin player). There is always a certain 'maintenance factor'. In that game, which started in 2008 with PHB1 as the only source, the STR cleric was predictably a bit hard put. I seem to recall giving out a couple good items that helped with that, and then DP and PHB2 also helped, along with the weapons in AV1. But that is the point, you had to keep finding these things. You can take "whatever cool feat" or "that power looks fun" or some oddball item now and then, but you better pay SOME attention to your build, or else you'll end up being what I called a 'baseline character'. It seems like when WotC P/T 4e the testers must have pretty much started at level 1 and just taken the most logical thematic and obvious choices (like followed the PHB1 build options). So they had these PCs, and they were basically able to 'cut it' at the established baseline of early 4e monsters and whatnot. The millisecond we all got hold of the game we built MUCH MUCH more effective characters than that, so there went things like monster damage, it was completely inadequate except at low levels to challenge anyone that optimizes at the "equal level is a moderate challenge" standard of the DMG. Then they added better feats! I mean, PHB2 feats definitely amp up PCs by 10-20% if used right.</blockquote>

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