Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Million Dollar TTRPG Crowdfunders
Most Anticipated Tabletop RPGs Of The Year
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
ShortQuests -- Pocket Sized Adventures! An all-new collection of digest-sized D&D adventures designed for 1-2 game sessions.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
AoO's and being "held"
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Petrosian" data-source="post: 1082848" data-attributes="member: 1149"><p>The obvious answer is that the held person or the door is defending better than the guy drinking a potion and thats why in a six second period you get ferwer opportunities to swing at the held person or the door.</p><p></p><p>I know i have run at least two threads on this, one in 3.0 and one for 3.5 after it too left the obviously contradictory text vs rules issue.</p><p></p><p>The answer typically boiks down to "the way we wrote the rules, it wont work to give AoOs against helpless people." </p><p></p><p>The followup question of "well why not write the rules right?" typically gets little.</p><p></p><p>With the rules for KIA at -10, allowing an AoO against someone who was just knocked to -10 will kill them, avoiding much of the death's door possibilities.</p><p></p><p>With the rules for AoOs being free swings, the possibility of someone with combat reflexes getting multiple AoOs against the HELD guy or the altar makes this very effective/dangerous and the current expected balances wont cut it.</p><p></p><p>In order to REWRITE the AoO rules to accomodate helpless, there is at least some other rules which would need adjusting to take it into account, which is why changing it NOW is tough as a sell. (hence the why didn't you write them that way in the first place.) its Ok to get theoretical six extra shots at a stupid archer because "he asked for it" while the tabel ot the held guy did not.</p><p></p><p>**********</p><p></p><p>My personal fave for a fix to make it make sense is to change AoOs from FREE swings to make them instead "earlier swings" allowing you to use your upcoming round's attacks earlier since their is an opening afforded by the lapsed defenses.</p><p></p><p>haven't playtested it yet though.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Petrosian, post: 1082848, member: 1149"] The obvious answer is that the held person or the door is defending better than the guy drinking a potion and thats why in a six second period you get ferwer opportunities to swing at the held person or the door. I know i have run at least two threads on this, one in 3.0 and one for 3.5 after it too left the obviously contradictory text vs rules issue. The answer typically boiks down to "the way we wrote the rules, it wont work to give AoOs against helpless people." The followup question of "well why not write the rules right?" typically gets little. With the rules for KIA at -10, allowing an AoO against someone who was just knocked to -10 will kill them, avoiding much of the death's door possibilities. With the rules for AoOs being free swings, the possibility of someone with combat reflexes getting multiple AoOs against the HELD guy or the altar makes this very effective/dangerous and the current expected balances wont cut it. In order to REWRITE the AoO rules to accomodate helpless, there is at least some other rules which would need adjusting to take it into account, which is why changing it NOW is tough as a sell. (hence the why didn't you write them that way in the first place.) its Ok to get theoretical six extra shots at a stupid archer because "he asked for it" while the tabel ot the held guy did not. ********** My personal fave for a fix to make it make sense is to change AoOs from FREE swings to make them instead "earlier swings" allowing you to use your upcoming round's attacks earlier since their is an opening afforded by the lapsed defenses. haven't playtested it yet though. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
AoO's and being "held"
Top