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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Irda Ranger" data-source="post: 4189780" data-attributes="member: 1003">Hmm, it sounds to me like your players think Defenders are "suckers".  That kind of non-appreciative attitude is hard to "cure" in a way that leaves the patient feeling warm and fuzzy. Do your players like team sports or group activities?  Personally, I've always appreciated that every member of the team is necessary to accomplish the goal, but then I have a personal background in working in teams.  Children who grow up solely watching TV shows without certain role models or playing single-player video games and never relying on people might not learn these lessons.I'm hardly a psychologist though, so that's just a gut instinct. The only thing I can think of is giving them a Defender NPC to control every now and then and making sure that guy gets a chance to shine in that combat. You're not "forcing" them to play a character they don't want to play, but you can ask them to play the NPC "just for this fight" and then give them some positive experiences with it.  Let them be the hero that fight, and really save the other player's bacon.It's important that the player gets the chance to save the others, because then (1) he'll have positive feelings for his accomplishments, and (2) he can be a champion for the Role to the other players.  Later on let one of the other players run the Defender that fight.Eventually they have to realize that "You know, we never would have been able to save the Princess without Sir Bob running interference with those Ogres. He really came through in the clutch for us."  Although honestly, right now, it sounds like they're not mature enough to appreciate help when they get it, so maybe they'll never learn this lesson. Maybe they just need to grow up.</blockquote>

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