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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 5886007" data-attributes="member: 42582">I agree that the game has changed, but I think your account of the 4e roles is a bit narrow.In my game:*the dwarf polearm fighter-cleric exercises close-range battlefield control - basically, nothing can get past him, and once he's in melee with an enemy it is almost impossible for them to escape; he also has one or two healing abilities, and is the only PC with Heal skill trained; *the paladin defends, in the sense of taking on the biggest foe(s) and soaking up damage and dishing it out (through various bits and pieces he has become the third-highest damage dealer in the party, after the two strikers); he also does quite a bit of healing, and is the party diplomat; *the archer-ranger shoots things, only very rarely gets into melee, and heals; he also has one or two "cleric calls down the divine radiance of the god" attacks; he is the stealthiest PC, the scout, the guide etc; *the sorcerer is the biggest damage dealer hands down, with a host of bursts, blasts and the like; he is very mobile in combat, but spends quite a bit of time in melee (using close attacks); he is fairly stealthy (as a drow he brings his own darkness) and very bluff-y (the trickster of the group); he is also the only PC trained in Thievery (via monk multi-class - besides Thievery it also gives him a 1x/enc flurry of blows - he sucks his enemies in via his Cyclone Vortex, then beats them all up with his ninja skills!); *the wizard is the lowest damage dealer in the party, but has some big control effects (a Bigby's Hand, Wall of Fire, Twist of Space (1x/enc teleport enemies), Thunderwave (at will push enemies); overall the weakest PC in combat, but the party ritualist and scholar.If I compare this to B/X or AD&D, the paladin feels like a fighter/cleric or a paladin, the wizard feels like a diviner/sage with some combat ability also, the sorcerer feels like a blasting wizard (but perhaps a bit blastier than is easy to achieve in those systems, I think) with a bit of thief multi-class, and the ranger feels like an archery specialist ranger from UA, but without the followers or MU spells (and not much like a classic ranger/cleric, because his only cleric-y features are the healing and a little bit of radiant damage).The fighter is the only one that I feel really couldn't be pulled off in that system, because there is nothing in classic D&D that models the combination of forced movement and lockdown that he brings to the table.</blockquote>

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