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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Takhisis" data-source="post: 5313365" data-attributes="member: 89689">Technically, the Death Master IS a 3rd party class, or at least the 3.5 version is. The Death Master featured in dragon was a 1e/AD&D class from like the 1980s. The 3.5e Death Master was actually created by Pazio Publishing and is from the Dragon Magizene compendium, which is a book by Pazio that takes old AD&D races and classes from Dragon and creates 3.5e versions of them. Thus, the Dragon Compendium, while it's materal are based on old Dragon Magizene issues, is not directly related to Dragon and it's classes(and races) are basicly homebrew made by Pazio that takes names, race and class concepts from old 1980s/AD&D dragon mags but keeps the classes distinctly unique to Pazio.So, yeah, as far as the Death Master goes, the 3.5e version was never featured in a dragon magazine issue and it was created by the same people who made pathfinder, not dragon. It only draws inspiration from an issue of dragon which came out in the 80s, so if your DM dislikes Dragon Magizene material for it's broken-ness and whatnot, then the Death Master should not be an issue for him/her so long as he/she is made aware that the class was created by Pazio and inspired by a pre-3.5e issue of dragon rather then actually being created by dragon.As for wizards being necromancers, they are not bad necromancers, it's just that clerics completely outshine them in the area of necromancy. Control/Command undead is also, not superior to rebuking, despite what you say. Yes, there is no save, but the issue with those spells is they only target one undead. This thus makes the spells inferior to rebuking in the sense you need to waste valuable spell slots on multiple casts of a single spell while a cleric, DN or Death Master can do generally the same thing via rebuking and not waste spell slots. Also, saying Planar Binding makes a wizard a good necromancer is like saying wish makes a wizard a great enchanter. Planar binding is an overall good spell, but not a necromancy spell. While it can aid a necromancer, it dose not make him a better necromancer then a cleric because it's not even necromancy, it's conjuration, hence my comment in the OP about wizard necromancers being conjurers who prepare more necromancy spells then usual. Wizard based necros need to rely on non-necromancy spells to even compete with clerics, and a necromancer, at least to me, should be relying on...well...necromancy and when a necromancer has to use overpowered non-necromancy spells just to compete with a cleric in the necro department, he's rather inferior at least in my book.</blockquote>

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