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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Uller" data-source="post: 228703" data-attributes="member: 413">Probably not pure wizards or sorcerers.   For a pure wizard to wear armor and use a shield, he'd have to spend TWO feats to be proficient in light armor and shields or multiclass.  Either way, seems a fair price to pay to me.   I just don't see that happening very often.   I think this rule would mostly effect bards and multiclassed wizards and sorcerers.2 or 3?  That's a 5-10% failure rate.  Seems about right for a character with high dexterity, mithral armor and proficiency in armor.  I've seen wizard characters achieve this anyway.   Mage Armor + Shield + Protection from Evil + Cat's Grace = AC 25.  With a 14 dex you could get AC 27.   An armored wizard can replace exactly one spell from this list with actual armor, but again, he must be proficient with that armor, so we are looking more at Fighter-type/Wizards and bards(and bards don't have a shield spell).  Only option 1 is core rules(PHB, DMG, MM).  Everything else is not.  My group doesn't use any splat books and I don't think that is going to change anytime soon.Personally, I've found such characters built with the core rules to be lacking.  Which is why I want to give them a little boost by freeing up one or two spells(or magic items) to provide a little variaty.  Since 3e came out, EVERY bard and wiz(or src)/fighter-type character in my group has had mage armor(and shield for non-bards).  It would be nice if these characters had another option to get a good AC(to compensate for their poor hp) and take some different spells for once.Also, I'm not too concerned with players running amok on my game.  Only one of my players is really a serious power gamer and he really isn't all that interested in any arcane-spell casters.  But there are three of us that like fighter/wizard types but we've all generally stayed away from them because we feel like you gotta waste a couple of those prescious spells on boosting AC before you can even think about some more interesting spells...Anyway...at this point we are actually leaning towards a rule like this...Armored Casting [General]Description:  The character is trained in casting arcane spells while wearing armor.Benefit:  If a character with this feat attempts to cast a spell while wearing armor, rather than make an arcane spell failure check in the usual, he may instead make a d20 check.  DC = 3. result = d20 + dex bonus* + Armor Check Penalty.  This feat may be taken more than once.  Subsequent applications of this feat give a +2 bonus to the spell failure check.  In non-combat/non-rushed situations, the character may Take 10 for this check.* note that the character's dex bonus is affected by the armor worn and his encumberance...So a character in full-plate with a 16 dex only has a +1 dex bonus.This feat is really the best of both worlds...it ensures that _ALL_ spell casters must pay a price(a feat) to be able to cast in even the lightest armor without failure(or heavier armor with a reduced chance of failure).   So even a bard with a +3 dex must take this feat if he wants to wear studded leather and  a shield with no problems.  If they want heavier armor, they need to take the feat multiple times(or they could just take Still spell and cast weaker spells...fair trade, IMO).Edit: Also note that the feat is a [General] feat...so Wizard/Fighters have limited number of feat slots they can actually use for this.  At first level, they can take it at most once(twice if human) and can't boost it again until they are at least 3rd level.</blockquote>

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