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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MrGrenadine" data-source="post: 5635719" data-attributes="member: 62619">I just started playing a wizard (9th lvl) in my weekly 4e game, so I'm really interested in this conversation, but I'm having trouble wrapping my head around the benefits of EoT, especially in terms of whether or not the enemies will move.Maybe a hypothetical will help me:Say there are 2 enemies 8 squares north of a wizard (arcanist) with an empty square between them.  Init is Wizard, then enemies, and on her turn, the wizard drops a FS right in the empty square between the monsters.  (Assume that there are other allies and enemies on the battlefield, but these three foes are engaged for the next few rounds.)[sblock="With SoT damage:"]One of the targets will take initial damage.  The wizard's turn ends.Enemy A takes damage on his turn, then can attack.  It seems plausible that the enemy will move toward the wizard to both avoid taking more damage at the start of his next turn, and to attack the source of the damage.  So, enemy A moves 6 squares toward the wizard, angling slightly to come up on the wizard's left side.Enemy B takes damage on his turn, sees what A is doing, and runs 8 squares toward the wizard's right side to try to flank her.Wizard's turn.  She sustains minor, then moves the FS south 6 squares adjacent to the only enemy she can reach:  enemy A.  Now the Wizard has a Standard left, if I'm correct, so she can move away from the approaching enemies, attack enemy A with the FS, or use any of her available powers.  Lets say she attacks B, and hits, but B is still up.Enemy A takes damage, then moves to flank the Wizard and attacks.Enemy B melee attacks as well.On the Wizard's next turn, she sustains minor, and can move the FS closer to herself.  She can still only affect one of the monsters, however, so she moves it adjacent to B, since it seems more heavily wounded.Enemy A melee attacks.Enemy B takes damage, which kills it.And then the battle continues...[/sblock][sblock="With EoT damage:"]One of the targets will take initial damage.  The wizard's turn ends.Enemy A takes NO damage on his turn.  It seems plausible that the enemy will move toward the wizard to both avoid taking ANY damage at the end of his turn, and to attack the source of the damage.  So, enemy A moves 6 squares toward the wizard, angling slightly to come up on the wizard's left side.Enemy B takes NO damage on his turn, sees what A is doing, and runs 8 squares toward the wizard's right side to try to flank her.Wizard's turn.  She sustains minor, then moves the FS south 6 squares adjacent to the only enemy she can reach:  enemy A.  Now the Wizard has a Standard left, if I'm correct, so she can move away from the approaching enemies, attack enemy A with the FS, or use any of her available powers.  Lets say she attacks B, and hits, but B is still up.Enemy A takes NO damage, then moves to flank the Wizard and attacks.Enemy B melee attacks as well.On the Wizard's next turn, she sustains minor, and can move the FS closer to herself.  She can still only affect one of the monsters, however, so she moves it adjacent to B.Enemy A melee attacks.Enemy B shifts, takes NO damage, and attacks the wizard.And then the battle continues...[/sblock]Now, it seems to me that all things being equal, both SoT and EoT cause the targets to move to avoid the damage.  What I can't see, though, is how the EoT damage will EVER actually come into play if the enemies keep shifting away from it before attacking.Now, this is a very specific case.  Terrain, choke points, other allies nearby to defend against or damage the enemies, ranged attacks, added enemies--all of these things will significantly change the tactics of every creature in the battle.But I can't (yet) see how EoT is better at controlling, or more effective on the battlefield.</blockquote>

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