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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Storm Raven" data-source="post: 3223748" data-attributes="member: 307">So, now you are in the same position as the literature professor who argued that the four fire engines in Farenheit 451 represented the four horsemen of the apocalypse. And his students called shenanigans on him. And so they got in touch with Ray Bradbury, and he told them that that theory was full of something that comes out of the hind end of a horse.Actually, they aren't very similar. Almost no prior character was like Cugel. No prior character was like Ogier. And, with the exception of game-related fiction, none that have followed have been like them. If they were archetypes, then they would have imitators, and they don't.No, it doesn't. Which is why your Jungian analysis is full of the same stuff that the literature professor's theory on fire engines had in it.Except, in the 1e D&D rules, you really don't. Wearing plate armor is pretty much the only viable option if you want to survive as a fighter. And, more to the point, the fighter class doesn't fit any antecedent. Which makes it not an archetype.I didn't say you were unwilling to change your mind (although you are), I said you have a predetermined outcome that you want (classes are archetypes) and are trying to massage the evidence to meet that conclusion. I am just following the evidence where it leads, and thus far, it doesn't lead anywhere near your conclusion. If the evidence led elsewhere, I would follow it to a different conclusion. But, thus far, it does not. And no amount of wishful thinking on your part will get it to go there.</blockquote>

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