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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Desdichado" data-source="post: 3225953" data-attributes="member: 2205">Now I'm even more confused.  Which class represents the "child", for instance?  For one thing, I'm not terribly impressed myself with either Jung or Campbell and their reduction of all characters into a handful of vague and broad roles--they're so vague and broad as to be fairly meaningless, IMO.  Also, their constructs related to literary and mythological characters, which doesn't map well to 1e, which is largely a very gamist, miniatures based tactical wargame still.  So, if you're not talking about the types of archetypes represented by the classes, I guess I'm a little at a loss here as to where you're going.Again; quite confused.  1e class restrictions aren't well suited for 3e, which has a retro feel?!  Those seem to be contradictory (albeit confusing and unclear) statements to me.  Also, I never claimed that 3e incorporated many other systems along with D&D (although now that you make that claim, I'll agree with it--elements of Rolemaster in particular are easy to spot, among others) but I have no idea what you mean by strong ties to Magic.  You mean Magic the Gathering?!  What strong ties are you talking about?Uck.  No thanks.  I did that back when 1e was current and I was in junior high.  It's not a "learning experience" as far as I'm concerned, except that I learned that D&D was a frustrating game to play, and I left it and migrated through other RPG systems until 3e/d20 was released.  I think the market (and if not, certainly me) have moved beyond such blatant gamist constructions that constantly remind me that I'm playing the equivalent of a complex tabletop wargame or boardgame.  There's been a push in RPGs in general, and in D&D in particular to allow player characters to better emulate the kinds of characters that you read about in fantasy books or see in action movies.  That hasn't weakened the archetypical nature of the classes, IMO, but it certainly has broadened the scope for any given individual character.</blockquote>

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