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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ElectricDragon" data-source="post: 3693460" data-attributes="member: 10778">Personally, I've been playing usually weekly for 29 years. My players, though, do have less time playing than I (15 years, 12 years, 1 year, and 22 years). We played tonight, and flatfooted touch AC came up. Surprise round, Touch spell against a flatfooted opponent: touch AC - dodge and Dexterity. But during combat when I am running 8 monsters with various weapons and armors and dodge bonuses and ACs as well as 3 pack animals, lowered lighting conditions, and rough terrain, having to stop and figure out each AC for each creature because a common thing like surprise happened is rediculous. What if I'd thrown dread wraiths at them? Spring Attack from walls and floor, surprise, incorporeal touch, flatfooted, 50% miss chance, touch attacks, uncanny dodge, arrgh!Personally, I've yet to see an armor as DR system that I could live with, or a system of Class Defense that goes up with level.I guess I'll just have to make up my own 6AC place character sheets.CiaoDave</blockquote>