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<blockquote data-quote="takasi" data-source="post: 3615149" data-attributes="member: 20194">Spell like abilities, or supernatural abilities like the bard's Fascinate and Suggestion, do not have the verbal or somatic components of a Suggestion spell.&nbsp; An opponent would not detect what is happening, and thus would not have the opportunity to decide if what's happening is hostile act or not.And I don't see how a surprise round vs. initiative order would make a difference in this case.&nbsp; If no one has provoked an attack, yet the DM makes the call for init, then I don't see why the player should be penalized.Certainly, if it has verbal and somatic components.&nbsp; Yes, because the opponent is aware that a spell is being cast.Yes. It is very different.&nbsp; You can ready an action to counterspell, or attack someone who is casting a spell.&nbsp; You cannot do the same for a spell-like ability, as there are no spell components.&nbsp; You have no idea if they are trying to fascinate you or not, but everyone knows, at least by raw, when verbal and somatic spell components come into play.&nbsp; And again, let's say we did agree that Fascinate is, by itself, considered a hostile action that would break a Fascination.&nbsp; When would Fascinate ever work?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="takasi, post: 3615149, member: 20194"] Spell like abilities, or supernatural abilities like the bard's Fascinate and Suggestion, do not have the verbal or somatic components of a Suggestion spell. An opponent would not detect what is happening, and thus would not have the opportunity to decide if what's happening is hostile act or not. And I don't see how a surprise round vs. initiative order would make a difference in this case. If no one has provoked an attack, yet the DM makes the call for init, then I don't see why the player should be penalized. Certainly, if it has verbal and somatic components. Yes, because the opponent is aware that a spell is being cast. Yes. It is very different. You can ready an action to counterspell, or attack someone who is casting a spell. You cannot do the same for a spell-like ability, as there are no spell components. You have no idea if they are trying to fascinate you or not, but everyone knows, at least by raw, when verbal and somatic spell components come into play. And again, let's say we did agree that Fascinate is, by itself, considered a hostile action that would break a Fascination. When would Fascinate ever work? [/QUOTE]

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