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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Are players always entitled to see their own rolls?
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<blockquote data-quote="iserith" data-source="post: 6728127" data-attributes="member: 97077"><p>The biggest stumbling block for many groups is Wisdom (Insight). An NPC is saying something to the PCs. One of the players says words to the effect of "I try to figure out if the NPC is lying."</p><p></p><p>The DM then asks for a Wisdom (Insight) check, perhaps opposed by the NPC's Charisma (Deception) check or just against a static DC the DM sets. The player rolls very low to which the DM responds, "He's telling the truth it seems..." or "You believe him." So now you have a player that sees a low roll and the DM telling him something that might well be contrary to the result. In effect, the DM has set up the conditions for the player to "metagame" and many groups just expect that player to play along with what the DM said despite the die roll's ominous result or else he or she is a filthy "metagamer." Repeated offenses might see the DM start rolling for the players behind the screen.</p><p></p><p>There is a way around this that avoids the issue altogether. The action taken is trying to figure out if the NPC is lying (or trying to discern the truthfulness of the NPC). So the failed check result is, very simply, "You're unable to do that unless something about the interaction changes." You're not telling the player what the character believes. You're not making any dubious statements about the NPC's truthfulness. You're just saying that what the PC tried to do didn't succeed. He or she is free to believe the NPC or not - examining the NPC's body language and mannerisms just didn't help.</p><p></p><p>If the DM does things that way, there is no opportunity for "metagaming" and no need to roll for the players behind a screen.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="iserith, post: 6728127, member: 97077"] The biggest stumbling block for many groups is Wisdom (Insight). An NPC is saying something to the PCs. One of the players says words to the effect of "I try to figure out if the NPC is lying." The DM then asks for a Wisdom (Insight) check, perhaps opposed by the NPC's Charisma (Deception) check or just against a static DC the DM sets. The player rolls very low to which the DM responds, "He's telling the truth it seems..." or "You believe him." So now you have a player that sees a low roll and the DM telling him something that might well be contrary to the result. In effect, the DM has set up the conditions for the player to "metagame" and many groups just expect that player to play along with what the DM said despite the die roll's ominous result or else he or she is a filthy "metagamer." Repeated offenses might see the DM start rolling for the players behind the screen. There is a way around this that avoids the issue altogether. The action taken is trying to figure out if the NPC is lying (or trying to discern the truthfulness of the NPC). So the failed check result is, very simply, "You're unable to do that unless something about the interaction changes." You're not telling the player what the character believes. You're not making any dubious statements about the NPC's truthfulness. You're just saying that what the PC tried to do didn't succeed. He or she is free to believe the NPC or not - examining the NPC's body language and mannerisms just didn't help. If the DM does things that way, there is no opportunity for "metagaming" and no need to roll for the players behind a screen. [/QUOTE]
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